What a difference handloading makes

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  • What a difference handloading makes

    grendel rifle target 20110916.JPGgrendel rifle.jpgonce-fired brass
    Sierra 107 grn HPBT
    BL-C(2)
    CCI 450

    Brass tumbled, washed, slight case mouth chamfer, primer pocket reamed (Sinclair tool). Sized on Hornady die with expander button removed (I decap in a separate step, before tumbling). Bullets seated to 2.265" with Hornady die. No binding in my 10 or 14-round mags. Haven't tried them in the 25 rounder.

    Les Baer 24" hvy bbl on a Mega billet side-charger upper with plain-Jane DPMS vented free float tube. Ace ARFX stock. RRA 2-stage trigger on Stag(?) lower. Bushnell 4200 4-16x scope set to 14 power. Bipod front and sandbag rear.

  • #2
    Originally posted by ss355 View Post

    On my third group, using the rounds over 30 grns of BL-C2, the first two shots printed a single, oblong hole. I concentrated really hard on my sight picture and trigger pull, and the attached cellphone pic of the target shows the result. My last two groups, both with higher charge weights, turned in average performance, though I’ll admit that after the third group I was so giddy I didn’t concentrate too hard on my technique.
    .
    Inconsistency in this one point can many times have an impact on the shot group.

    There is the old saying that you have to find the bullet/load that your rifle likes. Reloading offers you the oppurtunity to test many different bullet weights, powder loads, etc. to find what your rifle likes best. Good job!

    Comment

    • leopard6.5

      #3
      ss355: What types of factory ammo did you try?

      My Les Baer with Black Hills shot through it shot sub-MOA. One five shot group looked like three shots all touching and another five shot group looked like one and a half shots( I had to examine carefully to make sure of what I was seeing).

      Keep up the good work.

      Lee

      Comment


      • #4
        RStewart, you make a good point about inconsistency in sight picture and trigger pull having an affect on shot groups. I'd like to think I'm a pretty fair judge of whether I shot as good a group as I'm able, so I do know at times that I don't print as small a group as I'd like. I'm confident that I was on target for those first two groups, the ones shot with 29 and 29.5 grns. The last two groups, the 30.5 and 31.5, some of the group size could be user error.

        Lee, I tried Black Hills Sierra 123 HPBT, Black Hills Hornady 123 Amax, AA 123 Scenar HPBT, AA 130 Scirocco, Hornday 123 Amax. I thought I tried one other load, but I know I haven't shot any Wolf or Precision Firearms loads, so maybe just those 5. Here are typical results with Hornady Amax and AA Scenar loads:

        grendel rifle target 20100630.JPG

        Comment

        • Bill Alexander

          #5
          What you are seeing is exactly why we developed the Grendel chamber. It might come as a surprise to a few but we actually know a little about this cartridge and its chamberings. The stupid 0.295" neck (yes it is absolutely stupid) is actually an Alexander Arms print. Funny, CSS appears to have not invented or developed anything despite the stamping and shouting, no chamber prints, no brass prints and no loading data. We drew this print to examine the effects of a tighter neck on accuracy and durability and quickly concluded it did not help in any way. In abandoning the chamber the details of matching it to the case print were not finished so when other case manufacturers come on line problems result. If you think Hornady was problematic wait until you see the steel case.

          The LBC chamber with the 0.120" freebore returns to work that originated before the release of Grendel (this was an extremely early print we made and tested in several guns) and which nearly caused the abandonment of the whole caliber. Barrels so chambered are so individualistic as to be near impossible. The good loads are truely good but if you do not happen upon the magic combination then the accuracy is terrible. This is impractical for any production gun. Someone wanting a target rifle is going to be unhappy if his barrel only likes 95g Vmax handloads and a hunter whose barrel only will only shoot 123 Scenar factory is not going to be a fan either. And if you think this is just an annoyance try this chamber as a production run unit in rack grade barrels not high end cut units. I have seen buckshot group tighter.

          The essence of the Grendel chamber is that it will generally shoot just about anything that fits in the magazine acceptably well without having to use exteremly high end barrels and hand selecting the candidates.

          Comment


          • #6
            I agree with you Bill on the G accepting and shooting reasonably good groups with about anything. I guess I should clarify that since I am a Precision shooter I like to tinker with powders and bullets. I stay in the 120 and 123 grain bullets for testing. A 1/2 moa is great, but 1/4 moa is always better. Especially out at 600 yards and beyond.

            Comment

            • COTNTOP
              Warrior
              • Mar 2011
              • 168

              #7
              Just received my 24 in. AWS/Shilen barrel upper and it is really shooting great. Printing 1/4 to 1/2 in. groups with AA 123gr Scenars at 100 yds. Gonna start on my handloads the weekend.

              Comment

              • robsf49ers

                #8
                reloads

                Originally posted by Bill Alexander View Post
                What you are seeing is exactly why we developed the Grendel chamber. It might come as a surprise to a few but we actually know a little about this cartridge and its chamberings. The stupid 0.295" neck (yes it is absolutely stupid) is actually an Alexander Arms print. Funny, CSS appears to have not invented or developed anything despite the stamping and shouting, no chamber prints, no brass prints and no loading data. We drew this print to examine the effects of a tighter neck on accuracy and durability and quickly concluded it did not help in any way. In abandoning the chamber the details of matching it to the case print were not finished so when other case manufacturers come on line problems result. If you think Hornady was problematic wait until you see the steel case.

                The LBC chamber with the 0.120" freebore returns to work that originated before the release of Grendel (this was an extremely early print we made and tested in several guns) and which nearly caused the abandonment of the whole caliber. Barrels so chambered are so individualistic as to be near impossible. The good loads are truely good but if you do not happen upon the magic combination then the accuracy is terrible. This is impractical for any production gun. Someone wanting a target rifle is going to be unhappy if his barrel only likes 95g Vmax handloads and a hunter whose barrel only will only shoot 123 Scenar factory is not going to be a fan either. And if you think this is just an annoyance try this chamber as a production run unit in rack grade barrels not high end cut units. I have seen buckshot group tighter.

                The essence of the Grendel chamber is that it will generally shoot just about anything that fits in the magazine acceptably well without having to use exteremly high end barrels and hand selecting the candidates.
                I agree with Bill, My AA 24" Barrel at 300.00 smokes my Satern 20" at 560.00 maybe that will change after more rounds ( i HOPE) are shot. Right now I take the AA out first. I will Post pics Once I can

                Comment

                • jwilson1985

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Bill Alexander View Post
                  What you are seeing is exactly why we developed the Grendel chamber. It might come as a surprise to a few but we actually know a little about this cartridge and its chamberings. The stupid 0.295" neck (yes it is absolutely stupid) is actually an Alexander Arms print. Funny, CSS appears to have not invented or developed anything despite the stamping and shouting, no chamber prints, no brass prints and no loading data. We drew this print to examine the effects of a tighter neck on accuracy and durability and quickly concluded it did not help in any way. In abandoning the chamber the details of matching it to the case print were not finished so when other case manufacturers come on line problems result. If you think Hornady was problematic wait until you see the steel case.

                  The LBC chamber with the 0.120" freebore returns to work that originated before the release of Grendel (this was an extremely early print we made and tested in several guns) and which nearly caused the abandonment of the whole caliber. Barrels so chambered are so individualistic as to be near impossible. The good loads are truely good but if you do not happen upon the magic combination then the accuracy is terrible. This is impractical for any production gun. Someone wanting a target rifle is going to be unhappy if his barrel only likes 95g Vmax handloads and a hunter whose barrel only will only shoot 123 Scenar factory is not going to be a fan either. And if you think this is just an annoyance try this chamber as a production run unit in rack grade barrels not high end cut units. I have seen buckshot group tighter.

                  The essence of the Grendel chamber is that it will generally shoot just about anything that fits in the magazine acceptably well without having to use exteremly high end barrels and hand selecting the candidates.
                  getem bill lol... i know the behind the scenes b.s and i cant agree with you more

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by robsf49ers View Post
                    I agree with Bill, My AA 24" Barrel at 300.00 smokes my Satern 20" at 560.00 maybe that will change after more rounds ( i HOPE) are shot. Right now I take the AA out first. I will Post pics Once I can
                    No, you apparently didn't understand Bill, since Satern was a licensed producer and made full-Grendel-spec barrels.

                    Comment

                    • bwaites
                      Moderator
                      • Mar 2011
                      • 4445

                      #11
                      Originally posted by robsf49ers View Post
                      I agree with Bill, My AA 24" Barrel at 300.00 smokes my Satern 20" at 560.00 maybe that will change after more rounds ( i HOPE) are shot. Right now I take the AA out first. I will Post pics Once I can
                      Even good barrel makers make a barrel that occasionally doesn't meet expectations. Sometimes its assembly issues, sometimes finding the right powder/bullet combo, sometimes, it just is.

                      Comment

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