No More Satern or Liberty 6.5G or 50B Barrels

[tx4guns]

Just saw this on ARFCOM.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=121&t=537430

[Norsk]

I knew I should have stayed away from this round! You see I'm bad luck and now that I own one it will slowly die. This will be the first step in a slow downward spiral and it all my fault. I'm sorry for bringing my jinx to the round you guys all love.

P.S. I'm off to order a satern before I can

[kamrr4437]

Yep i was just fixing to post this. Its posted on Satern's webpage. This is most unfortunate. Well at least i got my order in. This is deeply depressing indeed.

[LRRPF52]

Guys,

I wouldn't worry too much about it, although it is unfortunate for those who have developed a great customer-barrel maker relationship with Satern and this cartridge. After shooting a Satern-barreled Grendel recently, I was really impressed with its accuracy and handling. It was also an AA-built gun. I have an AA-Shaw pipe, and I don't see this affecting too much in demand. There are a lot of Grendel owners out there, which can easily be figured by the brass-consumption we were seeing last year, along with the fact that I can buy loaded Grendel ammo off the shelf at one major local gun store, and Lapua brass from my favorite local reloading supply outlet.

Since I don't know the exact details of what is driving Satern's decision, it would be inappropriate of me to jump to speculative conclusions. I usually have precision rifles built by reputable smiths who can get whatever reamers they want, and there seem to be plenty of economy barrel/bolt combos available still.

We'll have to wait for the word on what exactly lead to this development, as I'm sure many are interested.

LRRPF52

[gophernuts]

Why wouldn't Bill Alexander put up a fight to keep these barrels coming? Or perhaps he did? Anybody have any inside info on this? I literally just ordered a liberty barrel today. If this round ends up falling away I will be extremely disappointed.

[LHClarke]

I should probably keep my mouth shut, but I cannot help myself.............It really pisses me off. I guess we won't be able to order barrels from Alexander Arms pretty soon. Oh well, but with the TWO suppliers dropping out of the game.........What is Alexander Arms going to do about getting barrels to sell? I just got their new magazine.........I guess I better order now as these might be collectors items soon?

What next? Hornady gonna quit making brass and ammo? I hope their contract is a little more "set in stone" and not able to be F'd with.

Of course, I am not "in the know" about who all supplies barrels to AA, but I sure thought it was Satern and Liberty mainly. I know that Shilen is an available upgrade but I don't think that they are the major players are they?

Will be interesting to see all the "buzz."

[kamrr4437]

I dont believe the round is going anywhere. You should be fine in that respect. Its just a shame to lose a machine shop that can help insert more grendel barrels into the general population hence more demand for ammunition making more money for the developers of these products. Still this is very dissapointing.

[sloan]

Heh clarke what proof do you have that Bill sank the satern deal. I was under the inpression that he no longer has controling interest,Ithought everybody knew that,I'm just saying easy on rock throwin,who knows who did what....sloan

[rushmc]

There was a thread on here yesterday that kind of said the same thing. It got took down. But, in any event, according to warped , AA will still be selling Satern barells. Satern just will not be able to sell them out to the street. Randy, do I have this right?

[warped]

That's what I understood.

[Drifter]

There was a thread on here yesterday that kind of said the same thing. It got took down. But, in any event, according to warped , AA will still be selling Satern barells. Satern just will not be able to sell them out to the street. Randy, do I have this right?

For what it's worth, Satern website indicates that they will no longer be manufacturing Grendel(R) and/or Beowulf(R) cut rifled barrels.

Sounds like they will not be making 'em, but maybe I'm misinterpreting...

[warped]

We shall see, it is also worth noting that they certainly seem willing to take orders for period of time right now.

Licensing had to do with selling to outside vendors, not selling to AA, you don't need to have a license to sell to AA, I should know.

BTW I am not sure but I would be willing to bet they were producing less than 10 bbls each for AA per month.

[warped]

Also keep in mind there are plenty of really good manufacturers out there that make Grendel bbls.

Templar is taking orders BTW, they make really accurate bbls, I know because I built several rifles with bbls from Bob.

He also offers nice options like custom profiles, Melonite lining, all sorts of good stuff and color selection is nearly endless.

He is friends with Steve and Deb, although even he does not know exactly what is occurring.

[pinzgauer]

but I sure thought it was Satern and Liberty mainly. I know that Shilen is an available upgrade "

Maybe I'm out of date, but it used to be Shaw for standard barrels and Satern/Shilen as upgrades.

And way back, Sabre & LW.

Given the Hornady grendel ammo and 123 AMAX's are still totally selling out periodically I find it unlikely that H would walk away from their sunk costs and a ready market.

Also, Satern's website has changed since yesterday and now mentions Liberty barrels. Don't know what changed in the licensing terms, but it sure looks like it's reached a tipping point.

[z06man]

That sucks I've been looking at getting a Satern.

Do you have contact info for Templar, warped? I googled it and didn't find anything.

[warped]

http://templarconsultingllc.com/templarconsultingllc.com/Home_Page.html

[z06man]

Thanks, warped. Is their website really underdeveloped or is there a problem with my browser?

[warped]

He is in the middle of updating it.

[Rust]

I don't want to imply anything underhanded by any of the involved party's but I would expect that unless they are in some way contractually bound not to they will be perfectly willing to make barrels with the non-AA licensed chamber. I assume that the licensing agreement has been changed to something they feel is no longer workable. But I don't see them walking away from the existing market since they're already in peoples minds as one of if not the top tier Grendel barrel mfg.

[kamrr4437]

good point Rust. It would make sense for them to do that rather than just drop out of the picture.

[smoke13]

Just ordered one of their last grendel cut rifle barrels. Ordered a 24". Can't wait to complete my build with a Satern barrel.

[hvlp6347]

I just ordered my first 6.5 from satern, I bought the 18" Spartan and I am ready for it to get here!

I talked to two of the companys who do business with AA and I have heard a little rumor about barrels coming from ......... Spain

There is an excelent company making barrels in Spain. and if I enjoy this new caliber as much as the rest of the guys on this site I will have to order one from B as well

[leopard6.5]

I talked to AA yesterday about the Satern situation and whether they were going to have another high-end barrel maker making the spartan profile barrel.
They said they are and they have more high-end makers lined up.

If one is Bergara barrels out of Spain that would be great.
I saw an episode on ShootingUSA where they took a Bergara barrel and mounted it in an ar-15. They seemed pretty pleased with it.

hvlp6347- good luck with your build and you may want to check out the monolithic upper at AA. I think they are Mega uppers and should really add to the rigidity of the upper.
I'm building an upper with the Satern Spartan 18" barrel and monolithic upper now and if you like the style it may work for you.

It's nice to hear there are more barrel makers coming available but it would have been nice to also keep Satern available.

Lee

[hvlp6347]

Yeah I looked at the AA mono uppers and decided to go about it myself, I ordered a Satern barrel and a MEGA mono upper. I'm gonna give the Adams arms MID lenght a try since I already own it, I'll post some pics in a few weeks when I get it done.

[warped]

Mega makes them for AA

[myitinaw]

Mega makes them for AA

Which is why I went with Mega, and not AA... he he he

[warped]

It does not matter either way.

[WillD]

I just ordered my second Satern barrel. This one is an 18" Spartan. I had an interesting talk while placing my order. I think I'll be buying more Satern barrels in the future!

This one is going to be my ranch rifle. It's 5# lighter than my first Satern and it should be good hog medicine!

Cheers, Will

[BjornF16]

Just off the phone with AA...my 18" Spartan barrel I ordered has a 4-6 week wait (none on hand).

Any ideas who is the new supplier?

[Drifter]

Just off the phone with AA...my 18" Spartan barrel I ordered has a 4-6 week wait (none on hand).

Any ideas who is the new supplier?

If you're seeking only a barrel, and prefer to avoid the wait, you might consider Satern's leftovers (which include bolts):

http://www.saternmachining.com/satern_discontinued_sale

[BjornF16]

No answer at Satern...I tried all last week to get through as well. So then I ordered from AA. I was hoping they had Satern barrels on hand.

There aren't many cut rifle barrel makers out there...if they are going overseas, then I'm a little concerned on quality. I don't buy first model year cars/trucks...

[warped]

Many foreign bbl makers have been making rifle bbls far longer than companies here in the states.

Remember that in Europe those who can afford fine firearms are the upper class of society and quite demanding about quality.

[bwaites]

Bjorn,

If Bill Alexander sells it, he will stand behind it. I've yet to hear of an AA barrel that someone was dissatisfied with in the long run!

[BjornF16]

Copy...I suffer from having an engineering education/background before joining the military. I like to research and know what I am purchasing (which is why I am curious on the new cut rifle supplier)...it's a disease. ;-)

[smoke13]

The Satern web site shows that they still have some for sale. http://www.saternmachining.com/satern_discontinued_sale
When I purchased my 24" several weeks back, I had to keep calling several times a day for a few days to get through, and the lady said she doesn't have time to reply to email right now. But when I finally got my order placed I got my barrel in about 10 days. Still have yet to shoot it. Good luck with your AA.

[noone]

I just checked the Satern web site, and if anyone has the cash stashed away, it would be great time to buy a barrel for that "someday" build. I just wish I had some extra coin stashed away.

[WillD]

Understand that this notice is strictly about licensing. Others have overcome this obstacle already I wouldn't count Satern out.

Cheers, Will

[warped]

I hope you realize licensing was not about the money but adherence to a standard.

That is about the only way to control standards anymore.

[bwaites]

In reality, there was no licensing fee. The manufacturing agreements were not about money; but about quality, availability, and liability issues.

[warped]

In reality, there was no licensing fee. The manufacturing agreements were not about money; but about quality, availability, and liability issues.

Yep I agree and I am happy we are talking about it so that people understand what it is all about.

I was really getting tired of reading all over the internet about how much it cost and all the other lies and or propaganda being spewed to harm AA and the advancement of the Grendel and Beowulf.

In my opinion it was all just a game of "poisoning the well" for nefarious purposes.

The people that perpetuated this should be ashamed of themselves for such behavior and I as a customer as well as a manufacturer would stay far away from anyone spewing such crap.

[srg]

Satern still has barrels on hand. Just ordered a 24 inch with target crown. My first Grendel purchase.

[rkflorey]

A friend and I just ordered one Satern and one Liberty barrel for 6.5 stalking rifles. Range info to follow after the builds are complete. Per another members post you have to call contiuously to get through. Apparently everyone is in the shop and they are too busy to answer.

[BjornF16]

In reality, there was no licensing fee. The manufacturing agreements were not about money; but about quality, availability, and liability issues.

Just curious (I've seen some other forums and the "hit" posts some make there and I pay them no heed), are you saying that some of the former recent suppliers of barrels were not meeting quality and availabilty?...or was there some other contractual limitation that the parties wanted out of?

I don't really want to know dirty details, but if there was a quality issue it would be nice to know.

I'm really happy with my Grendel Entry from AA...I've taken 5 whitetails over the last two seasons. Friends who have been to the range and shot really like it and are impressed with the accuracy. So I'm building a light weight hunting version. Beowulf may be next.

[bwaites]

Just curious (I've seen some other forums and the "hit" posts some make there and I pay them no heed), are you saying that some of the former recent suppliers of barrels were not meeting quality and availabilty?...or was there some other contractual limitation that the parties wanted out of?

I don't really want to know dirty details, but if there was a quality issue it would be nice to know.

I'm really happy with my Grendel Entry from AA...I've taken 5 whitetails over the last two seasons. Friends who have been to the range and shot really like it and are impressed with the accuracy. So I'm building a light weight hunting version. Beowulf may be next.

Please don't read into it more than there is. I am not implying there were quality issues at the heart of the recent changes. My point was that the reason for the contracts in the first place was NOT licensing fees, but simply quality control, availability/distribution, and liability.

I've never heard a single ACTUAL Grendel licensee complain about the costs of licensing.

[BjornF16]

Sorry...I must have mis-interpreted. I understand the desire to control the specification, adherence to the specification and reputation.

[bwaites]

Sorry...I must have mis-interpreted. I understand the desire to control the specification, adherence to the specification and reputation.

No problem, my initial post wasn't exactly crystal clear!