Barrel Break-In (or how to shorten a barrel's useful life)

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  • NugginFutz
    Chieftain
    • Aug 2013
    • 2622

    Barrel Break-In (or how to shorten a barrel's useful life)

    I've read several opinions on what constitutes the proper method for breaking in a barrel, and have never really seen how one method differed from another. It also occurred to me that break-in was usually reserved for something which needed further polishing of moving parts, in order to ensure that continued "high speed" use would not harm the product, such as a piston engine. Well, while looking up some related information, I came across this:



    It is a condensation of the opinions of arguably one of the shooting world's best barrel makers and bench rest shooters.

    To summarize, it is the late Gale McMillan's opinion that barrel break-in is good for nothing more that eroding a barrels useful shooting life. He further says that the first barrel maker he knew of that provided break-in instructions informed him that it amounted to a 10% increase in sales.

    Further, it is clear that he abhors the use of any abrasive pastes to remove virtually anything from the bore, since wear cannot be adequately controlled without a lead lap.

    Surprisingly, he mentioned his preference to brass / bronze brushes, even over nylon. I have always been under the impression that nylon was less abrasive than either SS or bronze phosphate brushes. Learn something new, every day, I guess.

    One of the products he had recommended (bearing in mind that the source is now over 5 years old) was something called "Outers Foul Out". Sadly, I discovered that this is a discontinued product. Has anyone here used this? If so, have you found a suitable replacement?
    If it's true that we are here to help others, then what exactly are the others here for?
  • waveslayer
    Warrior
    • Jan 2013
    • 239

    #2
    I know that my barrel on my 308 and on my twin's 308 shoots better with it nice and dirty! When we clean them... we have to shoot a lot to get them back to where they should be.

    Comment

    • bwaites
      Moderator
      • Mar 2011
      • 4445

      #3
      I think the general consensus on the board is "clean less, shoot more". I only clean when I have a functional issue, ie. rounds won't chamber or extract, or accuracy begins to decrease. I have barrels that haven't been cleaned since last April, although they have been shot plenty.

      And no, I don't believe in break-in. That's what the barrel maker does when he laps a barrel and what I pay for when I buy a high end barrel!

      Comment

      • Kikn
        Warrior
        • Nov 2011
        • 689

        #4
        I like the post on lilja's website. Cliff notes version....

        Basically you want to shoot enough to get a good layer of carbon fouling while removing copper fouling. Essentially if you over clean your barrel you must go through the "break-in" procedure again to get a good layer of carbon fouling while removing the copper.

        Comment

        • Buster
          Warrior
          • Mar 2012
          • 344

          #5
          Originally posted by bwaites View Post
          I think the general consensus on the board is "clean less, shoot more". I only clean when I have a functional issue, ie. rounds won't chamber or extract, or accuracy begins to decrease. I have barrels that haven't been cleaned since last April, although they have been shot plenty.

          And no, I don't believe in break-in. That's what the barrel maker does when he laps a barrel and what I pay for when I buy a high end barrel!
          I'm glad I read this thread.
          I mostly shoot at a public range and talk to the AR shooters (as well as the FUDS) and their consensus has been the "dirtier" their AR is, the tighter it shoots. That has been my (non-scientific) findings as well.
          See how it shoots at 100, 500 and then 1000 rounds....or if/when it malfunctions, clean it.
          This philosophy has worked for me the past 3 years.

          I "broke in" my Lilja barrel build last weekend; shot, swabbed it it with a patch with Butch's Bore Shine, swabbed it with a patch saturated with Kroil and then a dry patch, lather, rinse, repeat....20 times. I was glad when it was over,,,took almost 2 hours.
          I didn't save the paper, but the cardboard back looked like this; 50 yards, GG&G iron sights...basically 1" MOA @ 50 yds.



          Talking about barrel break in; (3rd hand information), I had a guy tell me that worked for me, when he worked in an armory when he was in the service, whenever they replaced a barrel in an M4, they would load a 30 round mag, set the selector switch to "Pew Pew Pew" and dump the mag and then say, "Barrel is broken in".
          Last edited by Buster; 03-26-2014, 12:41 AM. Reason: Image link correction

          Comment


          • #6
            Ok a couple questions. I had a benchrest guy tell me that if you leave carbon build up in your barrel that it would attract moisture and create a corrosion issue. First is there any truth to this and if it is true should i be running a patch with oil through the barrel after i shoot. lastly what is the best method to remove copper while leaving carbon
            Last edited by Guest; 03-29-2014, 03:43 AM.

            Comment

            • explorecaves

              #7
              Originally posted by ccso118 View Post
              Ok a couple questions. I had a benchrest guy tell me that if you leave carbon build up in your barrel that it would attract moisture and create a corrosion issue. First is there any truth to this and if it is true should i be running a patch with oil through the barrel after i shoot. lastly what is the best method to remove copper while leaving carbon
              This should answer your question regarding corrosive ammo use. http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/corrosive-ammunition/

              Comment


              • #8
                Wipe-Out foam is beloved by the benchrest crowd. Caution, it also dissolves bronze bore brushes.

                Wipe-Out foam bore cleaner is a product we've used with great success on many rifles. With sufficient dwell time, it removes both carbon and copper fouling. You can combine it with Wipe-Out Accelerator or Patch-Out liquid to speed up cleaning time.

                Comment

                • Variable
                  Chieftain
                  • Mar 2011
                  • 2403

                  #9
                  Originally posted by NugginFutz View Post
                  I've read several opinions on what constitutes the proper method for breaking in a barrel, and have never really seen how one method differed from another. It also occurred to me that break-in was usually reserved for something which needed further polishing of moving parts, in order to ensure that continued "high speed" use would not harm the product, such as a piston engine. Well, while looking up some related information, I came across this:



                  It is a condensation of the opinions of arguably one of the shooting world's best barrel makers and bench rest shooters.

                  To summarize, it is the late Gale McMillan's opinion that barrel break-in is good for nothing more that eroding a barrels useful shooting life. He further says that the first barrel maker he knew of that provided break-in instructions informed him that it amounted to a 10% increase in sales.

                  Further, it is clear that he abhors the use of any abrasive pastes to remove virtually anything from the bore, since wear cannot be adequately controlled without a lead lap.

                  Surprisingly, he mentioned his preference to brass / bronze brushes, even over nylon. I have always been under the impression that nylon was less abrasive than either SS or bronze phosphate brushes. Learn something new, every day, I guess.

                  One of the products he had recommended (bearing in mind that the source is now over 5 years old) was something called "Outers Foul Out". Sadly, I discovered that this is a discontinued product. Has anyone here used this? If so, have you found a suitable replacement?
                  I never do barrel "break ins" any more.

                  Outer's Foul Out: It appears they discontinued them because of a lack of sales. If you still want, you can actually build one of those yourself with online directions, and can also make your own solutions.

                  I don't bother though, because I use the "bore foams" to great effect. I just spray them in and let them sit. They work great for lazy folks like myself. You can source those from a number of manufacturers, including "Break Free" brand (at Walmart! ), Gunslick, and Wipeout.
                  Life member NRA, SAF, GOA, WVSRPA (and VFW). Also member WVCDL. Join NOW!!!!!
                  We either hang together on this, or we'll certainly HANG separately.....

                  Comment

                  • montana
                    Chieftain
                    • Jun 2011
                    • 3209

                    #10
                    I have broken in 3 barrels that were premium barrels. I followed the manufacturers directions and have been very happy with the results. They were all lapped barrels but the barrel break in process resulted in barrels that seem immune to copper fouling. I thought barrel break in was redundant with hand lapped premium barrels till a friend and bench rest shooter explained to me the benefits of barrel break in when dealing with copper fouling. I dislike cleaning my barrels and breaking in my barrel allows me to shoot for a much longer time before I have to concern myself with copper fouling. When I need to clean my bore I run a few patches with Shooters choice and follow with a dry patch. I then run a patch with Sweets 7.62 copper remover. If you have copper fouling you will see it when using Sweets 7.62.
                    Using two premium barrels , break in only one barrel. Then shoot the same amount of ammo through them and then clean them. You will see a remarkable difference in the amount of time and effort required to rid the bores of copper fouling.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Bench rest shooters will sometimes change out a barrel after only 5 to 7 hundred rounds.
                      They clean a lot and aggressively to stay competitive.
                      I clean and oil my barrel after any shooting session and wipe out the bore good before I shoot it again.
                      When a barrel won't shoot after being shot a lot I get another one.
                      Grendel barrels should last a long time since the pressure is lower than other AR rounds.
                      Brass,bullets,powder and primers cost more than a barrel.

                      Comment

                      • cst
                        Warrior
                        • Jan 2014
                        • 239

                        #12
                        Is it possible to "rebreak" in a barrel that has several hundred rounds if fouling is a problem??
                        Last edited by cst; 05-27-2014, 11:23 AM.

                        Comment

                        • Drifter
                          Chieftain
                          • Mar 2011
                          • 1662

                          #13
                          Originally posted by cst View Post
                          Is it possible to "rebreak" in a barrel that has several hundred rounds if fouling is a problem??
                          Not sure, but some bullets are gonna lay down copper regardless. A bonded-core hunting bullet usually causes significantly more fouling than a match bullet.
                          Drifter

                          Comment

                          • NugginFutz
                            Chieftain
                            • Aug 2013
                            • 2622

                            #14
                            Originally posted by cst View Post
                            Is it possible to "rebreak" in a barrel that has several hundred rounds if fouling is a problem??
                            One of my best shooters needed to be re-broken in. (Actually, I doubt if it had even been broken in, in the first place) A CZ550 in .308, with a 26" barrel I picked up had some serious copper fouling. No matter how much I cleaned it, the patches would always come out with blue.

                            I finally hit it with some Tetra for 2 -3 cycles.Got the copper completely out, and did a semi-formal break in. Groups definitely improved, but the barrel still fouls - just not quite as severely as before.
                            If it's true that we are here to help others, then what exactly are the others here for?

                            Comment

                            • kmon
                              Chieftain
                              • Feb 2015
                              • 2095

                              #15
                              Have the Outers Foul Out, only break it out when there us severe copper fouling. I have 3 rifles it gets used on, and on some barrels of guns I have traded for or bought used just to easily get back to square 1. Most copper fouled barrel I have ever owned is a 264 Win Mag. After about 10 hours of cleaning I went and bought the Foul Out and it took 3 cycles to clean all copper from it. After a few fouling shots it shot groups just under an inch at 100 with factory ammo. Like someone else wrote you can find directions online to build your own and yes they work.

                              The next worst fouling gun in the safe is a Remington 700 Classic in 17 Rem. Accuracy drops off bad after 30 rounds, or at least it did until switching to what I see is a favorite powder for the Grendel, CFE223. After switching am to over 80 rounds and it is still shooting great. I use this gun to see how my shooting is when working up loads for other guns. If I do not shoot sun 1/4 inch center to center group with it then I am off.

                              I think most rifles shoot best with some fouling but at some point accuracy will degrade.

                              Agree with the one that said breakin usually makes cleaning easier. But with the foam cleaners and the Outers Foul Out available cleaning copper out is no big deal to me.

                              Comment

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