Preaching to the Choir

[stanc]

Another thing that gun owners ought to start doing is believing they can win the war. Many are outright defeatists who believe we can never win against what ever massive conspiratorial entity is in vogue that day.

The Brits just voted to leave the EU after months of nothing but opposition by every news entity, every government official from both sides of their isle, by the EU and every other socialist in the world. Months of propaganda failed to sway them and they voted to become independent again. And I thought that the one world government bankers had so much power that it would be impossible for the average citizen to change anything? What happened there?

The thing many gun owners are lacking is the belief they can win the war.

Gene,

I guess you can put me in that category, except that I do not operate on belief. I use logic and evidence, and the historical evidence can be summed up in one question:

When has any major anti-gun law ever been repealed, anywhere?

Sure, we can win a battle now and then, but the war? The historical trend indicates otherwise.

Brexit notwithstanding, the British are an uninspiring example in this matter.

I remember reading about a British king centuries ago, who complained that his subjects preferred to spend their free time on the golf course instead of the archery range. Then, many years later, another British king outlawed the private possession of bows and arrows.

And look at the current British anti-gun laws, which are much worse than in this country, yet have been accepted by the UK public.

Stan

P.S. In regard to the Brexit vote, I predict that will prove to be no more than a brief, albeit entertaining anomaly, that will be barely noticed in the historical trend to a world government.

[stanc]

and then there are the events between the Boston Tea Party in 1773 and cessation of offensive operations by British Parliament in 1782. The British were one of the biggest powers in the world at the time.

We were fighting a defensive war, on our own turf, against the British.

We never were strong enough to take the fight to the enemy's homeland.

The French aided us immeasurably in the fight for independence.

The British were waging a war on two fronts, fighting France and Spain, as well as us.

If we had been on our own against the Brits -- if the French and Spanish had stayed out of it -- we might be singing "God Save The Queen" now, instead of "The Star Spangled Banner."

That's essentially the position that pro-2A people are in today. Outnumbered, waging a defensive battle, with no allies to help.

[LR1955]

I absolutely agree. if we've already lost in our minds, actual victory will be difficult to achieve.

I am in the process of re-reading American Sniper, and in the book Kyle talks about his time in BUDS at the Navy Special Warfare Training Center in Coronado, CA., and the infamous bell aspiring SEALs could ring at any time if they wanted out. Kyle explains that the instructors would always offer those with thoughts of leaving a second chance, and even encouraged them to stay - Kyle explains that he later learned, that the the very thought of defeat entering an aspiring SEAL's mind was unacceptable and grounds for scrutiny, and that men that took the 2nd chance, and continued training, never went on to become SEALs.

I am just an average civilian, but man, that stuck with me. We've all heard "train as you fight" right.. well this is the mental equivalent. THINK as you ACT.

and then there are the events between the Boston Tea Party in 1773 and cessation of offensive operations by British Parliament in 1782. The British were one of the biggest powers in the world at the time. I Feel we are all probably pretty well acquainted with this story. as we should be.

Ok, Freedom rant OFF, thanks for your time.

BVT:

How is that possibly a rant?

Something I have learned is that once you get a thought of quitting in your mind, it is damn hard to get it out.

A way to fight such thoughts is by believing that pain, fear, and fatigue are temporary. Living with yourself if you quit is permanent.

No one is mandating how a person thinks or feels. They can choose to be a winner or choose to be a loser.

LR55

[JASmith]

It is all too easy to succumb to the defeatist attitude, but our best shot at protecting our rights is to hang in there and keep fighting!

Write, email, and call (all three modes) your elected representatives at every level of government. This is especially important if they are anti-gun. They know you'll likely be donating to folks who are pro-gun so may be booted out of office by not paying-attention to your views. This is especally true if enough of of us contact them.

Then donate to pro-gun campaigners either directly or through the NRA.

[rickOshay]

"That's essentially the position that pro-2A people are in today. Outnumbered, waging a defensive battle, with no allies to help"

Right Stan. But many have been here before and come through with improbable victories.

Our opponents have taken their position in spit of, in the face of, all the data and evidence against them. We must find a way to influence them without data.

As I've quoted before - 'Someone cannot be reasoned out of something they were not reasoned into.'

JASmith is right to point out actions are needed - phone, write, and send money.

Maybe Zevon was right too - send Lawyers, Guns, and Money........

[Bravo Vector Tango]

If we had been on our own against the Brits -- if the French and Spanish had stayed out of it -- we might be singing "God Save The Queen" now, instead of "The Star Spangled Banner."

That's essentially the position that pro-2A people are in today. Outnumbered, waging a defensive battle, with no allies to help.

I would like to think that we would have the support of our own military or at least a part of it, elaborating further may be getting into hot water, and/or tin-foil hat territory - so I will won't go into it further.

LR1955:

True, not really a rant. perhaps just me pulling a "CYA" in case I came off the wrong way speaking about something that I am very passionate about, haha.

[JASmith]

I used to think that communist rule of countries was like a one way street. You can get on but can't get off. Then the Berlin wall fell, thanks in large part to Ronald Reagan changing the game a bit.

The protection and enhancement of our rights is very much like the sruggle between God and the devil (or good and evil for those not comfortable with God). It is never ending with some wins and some losses.

We just scored a win in the Senate: http://ammoguide.com/cgi-bin/aiforum...tid=1466605849.

No one believes the war is over, but this skirmish gives encouragment that we can prevail with the proviso that no victory lasts absent constant vigilance and the occasional struggle.

[stanc]

If we had been on our own against the Brits -- if the French and Spanish had stayed out of it -- we might be singing "God Save The Queen" now, instead of "The Star Spangled Banner."

That's essentially the position that pro-2A people are in today. Outnumbered, waging a defensive battle, with no allies to help.

I would like to think that we would have the support of our own military or at least a part of it, elaborating further may be getting into hot water, and/or tin-foil hat territory - so I will won't go into it further.

No point in going even that far, because it's irrelevant, anyway. When we talk about a "war" over the 2nd Amendment, we're speaking figuratively, not literally.

There is no actual armed combat going on between the two sides.

[stanc]

I used to think that communist rule if countries was like a one way street. You can get on but can't get off. Then the Berlin wall fell, thanks in large part to Ronald Reagan changing the game a bit.

The protection and enhancement of our rights is very much like the sruggle between God and the devil (or good and evil for those not comfortable with God). It is never ending with some wins and some losses.

We just scored a win in the Senate: http://ammoguide.com/cgi-bin/aiforum...tid=1466605849.

No one belives the war is over, but this skirmish gives encouragment that we can prevail...

Ah, the human capacity for wishful thinking always fascinates me, especially when I see it in a PRK resident.

For those who believe it's possible to win this war -- as opposed to prevailing in a skirmish now and then -- I'll repeat the question I posed on the previous page:

When has any major anti-gun law ever been repealed, anywhere?

[Slappy]

I do not think that we are going to even have to worry about repealing anything because there will never be any Major Anti-Gun Law passed here in the USA. BANG BANG!!

Come November there are fixin to be some MAJOR changes.

[stanc]

I do not think that we are going to even have to worry about repealing anything because there will never be any Major Anti-Gun Law passed here in the USA.

Not sure if you're being facetious, or if you're blissfully unaware of such matters as the 1911 Sullivan Act, the 1934 National Firearms Act, the 1968 Gun Control Act, the 1986 machine gun ban, the 1998 California assault weapons law, etc, etc.

[bwaites]

Ah, the human capacity for wishful thinking always fascinates me, especially when I see it in a PRK resident.

For those who believe it's possible to win this war -- as opposed to prevailing in a skirmish now and then -- I'll repeat the question I posed on the previous page:

When has any major anti-gun law ever been repealed, anywhere?

Define "major". 30 years ago very few states allowed concealed carry, now all of them do, with a few very restrictive (CA, NY, IL) but the vast majority are "shall issue". That required the repeal of anti-concealed carry laws in many states. Very few states allowed open carry, now more and more do all the time. That required repeal of open carry laws. From my viewpoint, those are wins against MAJOR laws. It now appears that we will probably win the federal battle against the tax on suppressors, with no required LEO sign off already approved by the ATF. We are winning MAJOR battles, and I think the general public leans more and more to the 2A side, with the exception of the population centers in CA, NY, IL, and a few others.

[stanc]

Define "major".

See post #26 for examples.

[bwaites]

Pieces of the 1934 act are being killed slowly but surely. Interestingly, the ATF admits that they can't keep track of the machine guns supposedly in their registry, (many sales end up as re-registrations because the registry hasn't ever been computerized and cross referenced, and the original owner has documentation to prove it WAS registered at one time). So the 1934 act is mostly moot in real life. I believe we will see major changes in the rest of the laws you cite, as the nation swings more and more to 2A ideals. We tried the "gun ban period" and it didn't work, more and more people, even liberals who have been anti or non committal about 2A rights in the past, are starting to lean 2A. Look how many celebrities now are gun owners.

We are winning. Short a Hillary administration, I think we will see wins very shortly in those "Majors" you cite.

[SHORT-N-SASSY]

. . . When we talk about a "war" over the 2nd Amendment, we're speaking figuratively, not literally. . . .

It's WAR! Anti-Gunners Make Their Move - Outlaw Concealed Carry In CA (http://dailysurge.com/2016/06/war-an...led-carry-ca/#)