Bad grouping

[68wicked]

First set of reloads grouped like a shot gun blast. 123sst set at 2.255 CFE 30.6, 31, 31.5 grouping was 3.140, 2.957, 2.915. primers look good. 31.5 starting to show some pressure. Rifle is Aero upper/lower, alexander bolt and Mcgowen ss 22" 8.5 twist.. Barrel was broken per Mcgowens instruction. factory 123 SST shot 1.10" best grouping. Not sure what to do next this is my first time reloading for a AR. Any input would be helpful. Thank you

[Kilco]

I have had the same results in 2 quality barrels (shilen, Odin works) with CFE223. Velocity was amazing and pressures were low, but groups were very inconsistent. Tried 8208 XBR and my groups with 100 Amax, 100 TTSX, 120 BT, 123 SST and 123 ELD are all from .5 to .85. Big difference. My first recommenenation would be to try a different powder.

[NugginFutz]

My routine for reloading in the blind has condensed into the following:

• I do NOT use new brass for any load development. New brass has, as a rule, a smaller case volume and usually results in higher pressures/velocities. Always use fired (but not expiring) brass, or you'll end up doing this twice.

• I try to establish a bullet's preferred seating depth. Loading to a safe (moderate) charge, I will adjust seating depths until the group tightens up. (It doesn't matter if the group settles at 1" or 4"). I've found that a bullet will pretty much prefer the same jump, regardless of powder. Also, starting with a good seating depth makes evaluating loads easier, since the groups tend to be tighter from the get-go.

• I always work up loads in 1% case volume increments, ending up at or near the published maximum pressures for a given powder / bullet combination. For the Grendel, this means starting about 3 grains low, and working up in .3 grain increments until I reach the max. This gives me 10 steps, .3 grains apart, to watch my groups and to keep an eye on velocities.

• I always try to shoot at no closer than 200 yards. This serves to amplify any variations, and make differences in loads more readily apparent. This also reduces differences in point of aim, which reduces changes to my shooting position.

• To distribute any changes to wind or temperature across my load increments, I shoot in round robin fashion. This places one round from each load increment on paper for each cycle, keeping the changing temps or wind conditions from skewing the loads to favor one or the other.

Despite all this, sometimes I just can't get a given combo to work in my rifle(s). In my own attempts, I've seen good velocities from CFE 223, but accuracy had been less than desirable. My BHW 264 LBC tubes would not shoot groups for CFE worth anything, with the sole exceptions being the 120 gr SMK and the Berger 130 Hybrid. The 95 VMax grouped like a Taurus Judge, but with the 123 AMax improving to 1.5 MOA. The 120 SMK shot just under 1 MOA, at 30.0 to 30.6 grains. With the 130 Berger, groups began to really shape up at .75 MOA, but only at the highest charge weights and with pressure signs becoming apparent.

I have found that IMR 8208 XBR performs quite well for bullets up to 123 grains, but with the caveat that above 28.0, depending on your barrel, things get very interesting very quickly. For the 123 AMax and SST, my BHW's like 28.2 grains, grouping at .75 MOA or better.

Good luck with your development!

[jameshenry]

Try going from your starting of 30.6 lower in .2 increments to 29.0. That is what I will be doing this week, 20" Shilen on AA upper. I have semi flat primers at 31.1 CFE223, CCI 41 primers which are supposed to be hard.

[VASCAR2]

I'm loading 31.0 grains CFE 223 primers and CCI 450 primers in my 20" Shilen DCM Profile I got from Midway. I've used 31.0 grains of CFE 223 with Nosler Custom Competitions, 123 grain A-Max and 120 grain Pro Hunter with no signs of pressure. I've used this load in Lapua and Hornady brass without issue.

Have you checked your cartridge overall length? If the bullet is into the lands it could spike pressure. Most of my 6.5 Grendel loads shoot fine a few thousandths off the lands.

[StoneHendge]

If you want to use that powder, try a different bullet. If you want to use that bullet, try a different powder. Some combos simply don't work very well in any given barrel. I have rifles where I've found a load on my first ladder test; I have others where I've searched for months for the right combination.

[Cockednlocked]

What brass are you using, and are they all the same headstamp, and the same number of firings? Also, go 0.01 deeper with your seating depth (from 2.255 C.O.L. to 2.245 C.O.L. and see what happens. 2.260 is the max for magazine-fed rifles, and Hornady lists 2.245 for all its loads over 100 grains. I don't necessarily agree with not using new brass to work up loads, just make sure all your brass is good quality with same headstamp and same # of firings for any single loading lot.

I've tried BL-C(2) at 30 grains, WSR primers, AA brass and 123 AMAX and get good groups, MV is around 2475 fps in my 20" Odinworks barrel. My best loads, though, are CFE-223 at 31.5 grains with the 123 AMAX, or 123 SMK. They chrono at 2560 fps +/- 5fps. Shooting at 1000 yards at an 18" square steel plate, I'm putting 8/10 on steel. That's accurate enough for me, it's less than 1-1/2 MOA at that distance. I can get consistent 1 MOA at 200 with the same load. I find the SMK's shoot a tiny bit flatter from 200 yards and beyond, they hit a tiny bit higher using the same zero as the AMAX.

Thing is, you might have to experiment a while to find the load your rifle likes.

[maxxmojo]

I had good results with CFE223 when the temperatures were colder, but with the warmer weather my groups opened up quite a bit.

[mholmes]

I'm new to reloading 6.5 G as well. In fact I've not reloaded one round yet but, the length you show (2.255) seems long. Lot's of references to using 2.245 ?

[68wicked]

made a dummy round for overall length. 2.262 I showed no marking. Ill try a short length if it doesn't tighten up Ill try IMR 8202.Thank you for input

[68wicked]

Hornady once fire brass and Alexander once fired brass that was shot out of the same rifle I'm having issue with reloading factory SST was 1.5 grouping at 100yrds