Originally Posted by appleseed-kdc
Here is something that I wonder about when someone talks about driving a car as being done by the subconscious. If so, how come a person is exhausted after a long drive?
I actually don't subscribe to the "automated response" school of thought. I believe in staying in the moment, so whenever I perform tasks that are usually considered mundane or ones I have done all my life, I am trying to do them better each time..whether it be rolling out of bed, indexing my hand on my concealed pistol, or doing sweep arpeggios across 4 octaves on a 7-string guitar. Like martial arts, staying in the moment and being open to what comes next as a series of quick chess moves available to you is how I look at gross and fine motor skills that comprise complex tasks.
If I am performing them thoughtlessly, I'm usually not reaching my goals, and missing something. I find this to be common when a shot group opens up to .75 or .8 MOA at the range, when I know the system will shoot under 1/2 MOA. If you're exactly focused at the moment of truth when the shot breaks, and the crosshairs are dead-on, the group tightens. It requires a lot of mental focus that takes more energy than many other common tasks, because of the precision required, while holding the sight picture centered as perfectly as possible.
idk .i know when i was boxing they made us do basics all the time.the 1,2,3(left,rite,left hook) because there is a time in the ring where you are so tired and beat up that ur body would fall back to what was drilled in,even when you had no idea what you were doing.
still wore out,but did work but thats a different situation then cover,fire and weapon manipulation
The most dangerous thing in a fight is a thinking man, even when he's somewhat fatigued, where a certain mental toughness remains. This is one of the reasons why selection processes for more elite military units incorporate lots of sleep deprivation over weeks, not just a few days. Most people can't continue to function, and performance of basic tasks deteriorates, while the mentally tough drive on and thrive in these conditions, still able to perform higher levels of physical exertion, decision-making, while avoiding injury. Staying in the moment is your friend.
Boy, this is some deep s**t ! I want to have some time to re read this thread. LR--- the idea behind NPOA is that even if you do use isometric muscle tension while taking the shot that tension is balanced. You are not fighting against poor body position. In hindsight NPOA probably has little to do with muscle memory.
Originally Posted by LR1955
Two separate issues. I'm sure you remember how awkward and loose control you had when first started driving. Drifting, always correcting, were totally focused and didn't want any other distractions.
Once it became subconscious/automated, then driving one handed, eating, listening relaxed to the radio, yada...yada.
You get tired because it isn't the act of driving per se (keeping the vehicle in the lane). Its the other cars, pedestrians, trees etc. that your eyes are always tracking, and your brain is processing, as you drive. That is a lot of very fast visual information to process. Something the brain isn't really designed for, but can still handle. In the old days, we didn't travel very fast.
The point I was making in my previous post was that you train/practice until the action moves from conscious to unconscious memory. BUT...if you have bad form/technique, that is what you will get. It is a lot harder to unlearn/replace once learned.
You still have to think about the shot consciously, range, size, movement, lead, bullet drop. But the act of holding/supporting the rifle, using your support and trigger elbows, sling position and tension, trigger finger position and squeeze, respiratory pause, can be automated ie sub-conscious.
The music one was good but also think of basics like walking and speech.
Last edited by appleseed-kdc; 12-06-2011 at 02:04 PM.
If we're driving subconsciously, we and the rest of society are in serious trouble. I am more focused when driving than most other tasks during the day...
Front close sweep, front far sweep, rear view mirror, left side view, right side view, do I need to check blinds...repeat...intersection approaching DANGER AREA...check left then right for red light runners and pedestrians..blow through it faster than normal speed...slow down a bit..front close sweep, front far...
Yeah, I'm paranoid...helps keep you on the edge of awareness where you need to be. I also pay close attention to exactly what I'm ding while driving, steering wheel manipulation, throttle response and lag time, while thinking through every possible worst-case scenario that could happen in that moment.
My thoughts while driving would terrify everyone if they could see what I see...could make a great Final Destination movie.
Deep thoughts man....
I'm with LRRPF52. Our minds can make our bodies go way beyond what is commonly thought to be our physical limit. Mental acuity and situational awareness should be given much more emphasis in marksmanship training. Most people can adapt and make better decisions in the heat of the moment if they can figure out how to allow it to happen. I think we hear so many cliche phrases such as muscle memory from "instructors" because it's much easier communicate in terms of physical mechanics than mental temperament.
Makes a mental note NOT to post anything that requires reading, comprehension and critical thinking skills beyond a Two level, Black and White understanding.
NOTE: Last post on this thread.
Originally Posted by LRRPF52
Originally Posted by Alex4922
Actually, I think NPA exemplifies the concept and yes, the isometric tension balances and thus stabilizes.
Now I got to get this thread focused again.