More 95 gr. Brass Controlled Chaos Hunting Issues

[Double Naught Spy]

Ben and I both had a LOT of overpenetration of hogs, him with his Maker T-Rex and Speer Gold Dot bullets and me with my Controlled Chaos 95 gr. BRASS that were supposed to break apart and form multiple wound channels. These bullets did not appear to do this. Instead, they are zipping through most hogs like butter. I did recover just one of them from the shots made and surprisingly, it was not on the large 240 lb boar where that shot went through 18" or so of hog, entering the cheek and exiting behind the opposite side leg after going through the heart. Nope, the one captured was in a 165 lb boar hit on the run. Like my previous example, it failed to open and separate properly. Based on my limit testing and examination of hogs shot with this bullet, it does not appear to be a good bullet for hunting. It does not appear to be performing as advertised despite being within advertised specs. It may be a fine round for other things, but apparently not hunting.

Ben finally recovered a Maker Bullets T-Rex petal that had broken off. Previously, he has recovered several intact bullets. Finally, he got one to break and we only found the petal.

Here is the video from the hunts. Ben did some excellent shooting. On the last property, the landowner was quite happy for what we had done.

[Sticks]

Can't get any more unbias than that. Excellent work DNS, and a very fair review. Nice that you specified the "In 6.5 Grendel". Might work in a larger 6.5 cartridge - don't know. Let someone else do the testing.

[rickOshay]

Great report, as usual. I posted a link in the LFP summary thread.

[A5BLASTER]

Great vid as always sir.

Yea they need to make that bullet our of copper, then it might be worth trying it in the grendel.

Maker has a loaded 95 trex box ammo now wonder how it would do compared to the 85 Trex handloads Ben is shooting.

[Double Naught Spy]

Yeah, I had the first recovered bullet that didn't open and found the other thread from a couple of years ago where my bullet was a close match for what rickOshay had found. I was thinking it may not be a fluke. After recovering this second one, I am certain it is no fluke.

LRRPF52 suggested in a text to me that the round might be a much better performer at a higher velocity and rickOshay's information seems to bear this out. The Controlled Chaos 95 gr. in brass just is not a Grendel velocity performer for hunting.

As a personal aside, it bothers me when manufacturers say a bullet "performs" (e.g., fragments in a certain manner) or "expands" between XXXX and YYYY fps and then they talk about and/or show the performance where the bullet performs optimally which is usually nowhere near the XXXX fps end of the spectrum. A bullet that undergoes partial or minimal performance/expansion at the XXXX fps end of the spectrum isn't what people are looking for in bullet performance when they are searching for a hunting bullet or what they are seeing after being told how well the bullet performs. They want to know what it takes for the bullet to expand or fragment fully. In the case of the Controlled Chaos 95 gr. (based on rickOshay's post in the other thread), getting the petals to come off as Lehigh Defense says they are supposed to do in order to create multiple wound channels) means an impact velocity closer to 2700 fps which is much higher than their stated 2000 fps.

[grayfox]

I've been following this, I bought 2 boxes, just targets for now. But the brass composition (and brass color), as opposed to the 110's copper, gave me suspicions that it would be a harder metal and harder to open on impacts...
These data pics etc do seem to bear that out.
Might be able to use these in my creedmoor but don't know if I want to... have to ponder.

[sneaky one]

I sent 80-85-90 grn Brass chaos bullets to Rickoshay=ROS.. Maybe he could post the gel tests on those , as compared to the 95 Chaos. They seemed to be fine...

I learned long ago, go way lighter with lead free pills. It ups the speed to perform as needed in the Grrr.

Look back to my November 2015 post -I got lucky last weekend. It's in the hunting section. 280 lb buck.


77 grn GMX- 16" tube--3000 fps. Through spine behind shoulder, steeply angled shot from 22' stand= 26" of fist sized penetration. 21 yds., plus the stand height.

Easily performs same as a 6.5x55, in normal close in shots. Almost --- like the .260., at short range.

[Double Naught Spy]

I sent 80-85-90 grn Brass chaos bullets to Rickoshay=ROS.. Maybe he could post the gel tests on those , as compared to the 95 Chaos. They seemed to be fine...

I learned long ago, go way lighter with lead free pills. It ups the speed to perform as needed in the Grrr.

Regardless of how they did in gel, they are not available bullets at this time. https://www.lehighdefense.com/collec...ntrolled-chaos

As for going lighter with lead free bullets because they need velocity to perform, that only depends on the the particular bullet. Cavity Back Bullets' MKZ managed to open up just fine at 118 gr. and 105 gr.

[rickt300]

I had similar results from the .257 version started at 2800 fps.

[Les]

Nice job DNS, and always informative.

[holder1422]

have you thought about using the 110 CC from Lehigh. I have not personally used them but Underwood does sell them. Underwood claims an insane muzzle velocity of 2800 FPS, but i doubt it is actually that high in real world use. You can also buy them separate for the reloaders out there.

Lehigh markets the 110 as being built for the grendel and claim lower expansion velocities of 1500 FPS. this may be a better solution if it indeed was build for the slower speeds of the grendel.

Might be something interesting to try out.

[Double Naught Spy]

I would not consider any BRASS bullets from Lehigh Defense after my testing, regardless of the weight. The brass bullets did not perform as advertised for the parameters advertisied.

[holder1422]

the 110's are made with copper, and not brass.

Once again no real world experience, but i have heard the copper ones open up easier and more reliably then the brass bullets.

[Bigs28]

I reload the 110s. Out of my 16" barrel im getting over 2700 fps. I use them in my 12".

[holder1422]

What powder are you using for the 110's? I am hoping to start a load workup on them soon.