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  • Variable
    Chieftain
    • Mar 2011
    • 2403

    #16
    Bill Alexander listed a load on the old board for the Lapua bullet out of a 10.5" barrel. Problem is I can't remember if it was the 100gr. or the 108gr. bullet. I can't remember the powder either, but the velocity was an honest 2500fps. IIRC...

    What do you guys think the best powder (velocity wise) would be for an 85gr. Sierra out of a 10.5" barrel? I meant to try it back a long time ago but never did. I loaded some up for my 19.5" in the beginning, but the 120Nosler BTs were so accurate I never even finished shooting the first test batch for it.

    Since the topic is up again, I'd be willing to load some 85 grainers up and chrono them out of my 10.5" to see what the numbers are. I bought most of the popular powders back when I first started, but I haven't kept up lately.

    ETA: H335?
    Last edited by Variable; 04-24-2012, 10:40 AM.
    Life member NRA, SAF, GOA, WVSRPA (and VFW). Also member WVCDL. Join NOW!!!!!
    We either hang together on this, or we'll certainly HANG separately.....

    Comment


    • #17
      I use H335 to push a 100gr TTSX out a 14 inch TC contender at 2600. Lead core bullets would have more case room and would likely perform as well with a SBR. I think the trouble with a department is having different loads for different barrel lengths, as the optimal load for a SBR may not be safe for a 24 inch rifle in hot weather, or the Rifle load may not perform in an SBR. I'm sure it would be possible, but I'm also sure that a department would want you to pick a mag and shoot without worrying if this is the right load or not. This load does work at higher velocities in my rifles, but I haven't checked all scenarios, and all possible increased chamber pressure situations.

      Comment

      • txgunner00
        Chieftain
        • Mar 2011
        • 2070

        #18
        I don't think it will necessarily be too much trouble. A 24" barreled rifle would be used for special and limited applications. No different than a carbine vs. a precision rifle presently being used. A major advantage of a single caliber would be the loads could interchange if necessary. Chamber pressures wouldn't change that much from a load optimized for a SBR vs. a load optimized for a SPR/ precision rifle. There may be issues with over/under pressure through the gas operating system but that can be addressed.
        NRA life, GOA life, SAF, and TSRA

        "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."

        George Mason, co-author, 2nd Amendment.

        Comment


        • #19
          The American Sniper Association (active LE and Military snipers) did a study and sent out surveys to Police Dept. throughout the nation asking if the agency had been involved in a designated marksman type shooting and the circumstances over the last 20 years. The agencies that responded totaled just over 200 shootings. The "average" shooting distance was approx. 47 yds. Some were short (15 feet) and a very few were long (over 200 yds.) The 75 yd. number was attributed to the FBI and they refute ever giving that number.
          The bank shooting spoken of earlier where hostages were killed because of the sniper "missing" was attributed to laminated glass that the sniper did not know the composition of and is a vitally important factor when taking such a shot.
          The critical factor in LE embracing the Grendel is ammunition availability and cost. Most agencies use factory ammo for liability reasons, and at this point there are not enough choices ( available history/tests) to bring them into the fold.
          I would not hesitate to carry my Grendel if I was still working, but know they would not allow it. If I was deploying in a Sniper role I would have to do a considerable amount of expensive testing before I would trust the Grendel in penetration and deflection issues before trusting it like I do the .308. There are too many factors that are unknown about the Grendel and its capabilities. My 2 cents......Kevin

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by rkflorey View Post
            I would have to do a considerable amount of expensive testing before I would trust the Grendel in penetration and deflection issues before trusting it like I do the .308. There are too many factors that are unknown about the Grendel and its capabilities...
            I agree with you there. I'm not sure(correct me if I'm wrong), but I don't think that the Grendel outpowers the .308 untill a little somewhere after around the 1,000 yard mark.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by stanc View Post
              Next question?

              It seems like you guys have already answered this, but what about for patrol carbines? From what I've been reading, it seems like this round isn't so hot as it should be coming out of a 10-inch barrel.

              Comment


              • #22
                I'm really interested to see what Variable gets with his 10.5" Grendel pushing the 85gr Sierra's with a faster powder. 31 grains of faster powder behind an 85gr projectile should send it out at a respectable velocity. It wouldn't surprise me to see 2600fps with that combo. I still think 10.5" is a bit short for an LE blaster, especially for bigger guys, which is why I would lean to 12.5" so you could at least have a mid-length handguard, and still suppress with one of the micro-sized cans.

                Comment

                • BjornF16
                  Chieftain
                  • Jun 2011
                  • 1825

                  #23
                  Yes, Variable...I'm very interested in the results as well.

                  110 gr VMax in 300 BLK or 85 gr Sierra's in Grendel?
                  LIFE member: NRA, TSRA, SAF, GOA
                  Defend the Constitution and our 2A Rights!

                  Comment

                  • txgunner00
                    Chieftain
                    • Mar 2011
                    • 2070

                    #24
                    Originally posted by Variable View Post
                    Bill Alexander listed a load on the old board for the Lapua bullet out of a 10.5" barrel. Problem is I can't remember if it was the 100gr. or the 108gr. bullet. I can't remember the powder either, but the velocity was an honest 2500fps. IIRC...

                    What do you guys think the best powder (velocity wise) would be for an 85gr. Sierra out of a 10.5" barrel? I meant to try it back a long time ago but never did. I loaded some up for my 19.5" in the beginning, but the 120Nosler BTs were so accurate I never even finished shooting the first test batch for it.

                    Since the topic is up again, I'd be willing to load some 85 grainers up and chrono them out of my 10.5" to see what the numbers are. I bought most of the popular powders back when I first started, but I haven't kept up lately.

                    ETA: H335?
                    Interested as well. Ramshot X-terminator, Benchmark, 2230 & 8208 would be good candidates. AA2015 or H322 are a little faster but may push the edge on chamber pressures.
                    NRA life, GOA life, SAF, and TSRA

                    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."

                    George Mason, co-author, 2nd Amendment.

                    Comment

                    • Variable
                      Chieftain
                      • Mar 2011
                      • 2403

                      #25
                      I believe I have H335, X-terminator, and Benchmark at home. I'm supposed to be off this weekend, so if the weather allows and I don't get called in I'll chrono some loads. I have no idea what the max safe loads are with those combos, so I guess I'll use wolf brass and ease up to see what happens. Anyone have any ballpark figures for those powders?

                      ETA: I've seen 95gr. V-max loads with Benchmark listed at 30 grains, H335 listed at 31 grains, and X-terminator listed at 30.6 grains. It looks like the COAL should be 2.20". I'm thinking the 85gr. Sierra might be able to bump up just a notch higher in charge weight from the V-max loads being as it's 5 grains lighter? Opinions?
                      Last edited by Variable; 04-26-2012, 12:14 AM.
                      Life member NRA, SAF, GOA, WVSRPA (and VFW). Also member WVCDL. Join NOW!!!!!
                      We either hang together on this, or we'll certainly HANG separately.....

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        QuickLoad suggests that you should get 2375 to 2450 ft/sec with those powders at 50,000 psi in a 10.5" barrel.

                        The calculations indicate that getting close to 2600 ft/sec may push pressures to 55-60ksi.

                        Details in PM.

                        Looking forward to seeing how close your results are to the predictions!
                        Last edited by Guest; 04-26-2012, 12:48 AM.

                        Comment

                        • txgunner00
                          Chieftain
                          • Mar 2011
                          • 2070

                          #27
                          Originally posted by Variable View Post
                          I believe I have H335, X-terminator, and Benchmark at home. I'm supposed to be off this weekend, so if the weather allows and I don't get called in I'll chrono some loads. I have no idea what the max safe loads are with those combos, so I guess I'll use wolf brass and ease up to see what happens. Anyone have any ballpark figures for those powders?

                          ETA: I've seen 95gr. V-max loads with Benchmark listed at 30 grains, H335 listed at 31 grains, and X-terminator listed at 30.6 grains. It looks like the COAL should be 2.20". I'm thinking the 85gr. Sierra might be able to bump up just a notch higher in charge weight from the V-max loads being as it's 5 grains lighter? Opinions?

                          Makes sense to me, but as you said, ease up to it. Looking forward to your results.

                          btw- that's 10 grains lighter...
                          NRA life, GOA life, SAF, and TSRA

                          "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."

                          George Mason, co-author, 2nd Amendment.

                          Comment

                          • Variable
                            Chieftain
                            • Mar 2011
                            • 2403

                            #28
                            Originally posted by txgunner00 View Post
                            Makes sense to me, but as you said, ease up to it. Looking forward to your results.

                            btw- that's 10 grains lighter...
                            Phttthhh! LOL!

                            Fishing for powders and stuff this morning I uncovered my old test batch of 85 grainers that I shot through my 19.5" gun. My crappy notes said they went 2828fps out of that tube with 31 grains of Benchmark at 36 degree temperature. It was only a five shot string, but that ought to give a small hint. I guess I'll try the Benchmark first since I already have some loaded.LOL


                            Digging through my notebook I now remember why I dropped and forgot about the 85gr. Sierra load...

                            That load averaged 2520fps at 36 degrees temperature and I was officially addicted to the Grendel right there. Up until that point I never thought an AR would shoot that good for a five shot group.LOL I abandoned everything else and went to that load for things that needed to die, and used Wolf MPT for (relatively)cheap full auto and plinking. I hate reloading, but I'll take another stab at the 10.5" since it would be good to have a home defense round that might not be too overly penetrative.
                            Life member NRA, SAF, GOA, WVSRPA (and VFW). Also member WVCDL. Join NOW!!!!!
                            We either hang together on this, or we'll certainly HANG separately.....

                            Comment

                            • Variable
                              Chieftain
                              • Mar 2011
                              • 2403

                              #29
                              Well, the weather sucked all day Saturday, and today was a pile of domestic drama/chores. I just set the chrono out the door before it got too dark and shot the 5 benchmark loaded rounds that I had left over. I shot 5 factory Hornadys first to be sure the chrono was going to read everything ok.

                              I'll post detailed numbers if anyone wants them, but the numbers suck, so there isn't a lot of use for them in my book.

                              Temperature: 70 deg. F.

                              Chrono distance: 15 feet from the suppressor front end cap

                              10.5" AA upper (chrome Sabre bore)

                              Factory Hornady 123gr. Amax load
                              Average Velocity: 2214fps

                              85gr. Sierra HP handload (31gr. Benchmark, CCI #450, AA/Lapua brass)
                              Average Velocity: 2395fps

                              The 85gr. sierra load showed no pressure signs FWIW.

                              Guess I'll skip Benchmark...

                              Later when I get a chance I'll try the H335 and see what happens.
                              Life member NRA, SAF, GOA, WVSRPA (and VFW). Also member WVCDL. Join NOW!!!!!
                              We either hang together on this, or we'll certainly HANG separately.....

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                TAC & 85gr Sierras

                                FWIW: The one time I shot them, I was getting sub-moa @ 2808fps with 31.8gr of TAC....no pressure signs....18" barrel.

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