I was speaking of knowledgeable shooters, such as you I and some of the others.
We both know when it is us, we also recognize when it is the rifle.
That takes experience, some shooters are far too impatient and that results in a false conclusion.
BTW give a call when you get the chance.
I do agree with you though.
Many times the rifle gets blamed for something that is the fault of optics, I have seen that far too often.
Even reticle designs can be a real problem, using cross hairs that obstruct the target is just one of the problems.
I can afford and do have some top notch equipment. Does it automaticaly make me win matches? Nope! Still gotta be a SHOOTER.
Originally Posted by pappy42
Absolutely. However, with the best gear for the specific purpose, a shooter knows it is him who either does well or not. Process of elimination. I have found with less experienced shooters that they normally blame poor performance on themselves when their gear really is a huge contributing factor. Surprisingly, even relatively inexperienced shooters can probably shoot better than the mechanical potential provided by a service grade barrel, cheap Russian ball ammo, and lousy sighting systems.
Originally Posted by LR1955
You could shoot an airsoft rifle and beat most of us. You know you could take that "service grade barrel", ect. and outshoot a lot of folks with the best rifle made.
When you find that rifle that controls it's own trigger, reads wind and mirage, and instinctively knows when to hold'em and when to run'em; please buy it for me because I sure could use one.
Originally Posted by pappy42
No, not that good and not getting much better.
Have seen way too many Soldiers blame themselves when the culprit is primarily a service grade (and normally trashed) carbine or A-2 firing 855 ball using dot sights or ACOGs that just don't work real well for the task.
No, they should'nt be issued a match grade carbine and ammo because that is the other extreme where they probably won't have the time, motivation, or ability to meet the mechanical potential of their gear. Would be a waste of money.
I guess it is a fine line between equipment and skill. Just that in more cases than otherwise, Joe could shoot his carbine or A-2 better than its mechanical potential (which is pretty poor by civilian standards) but they didn't know it. When that happens, not much you can do to convince him he is good. He has to see good and won't if his blaster / ammo combination shoots four or five minutes.
Got to go. If / when John and Bill set up a Training forum I can go into more detail. Right now I need to do some work with guys who are much better than their trashed A-2's.
A fair rifle, decent shooter, and lots of practice will almost always beat out a the best rifle possible, lousy shooter and no practice.
I'm fortunate that AA built me a great rifle. That rifle, and practicing makes a huge difference in my favor.
I alwys enjoy hearing from you folks who are out there shooting and teaching.
I still shoot quite a bit. Quit teaching a couple of years ago. I miss the teaching part. There is much I would like to pass on to someone, but few people have the time or dedication to put into learning it. And, there are some things that I just wouldn't teach anyone until I knew them really well. Just like when I was taking Jujutsu. They don't teach lower belts anything about breaking necks and similar things for a good reason. It took years before they started teaching me that stuff. It is the same with much regarding fighting with weapons as opposed to teaching simple marksmanship.
Marksmanship is something any responsible gun owner should learn. The real down and dirty fighting with a firearm simply isn't necessary for most people.
I was fortunate that when I started competitvely shooting F-Class, 2 High Masters took me under their wing to teach me. The first rule I learned was- Listen, ask questions, but your opionion doesn't matter. It wasn't meant to be rude, but that their time was limited and if someone felt they already "knew" what to do, they didn't spend the time with them. Though I have hunted since I was 6, they got me back to the basics. From proper position, to trigger squeezing (not pulling), to breaking the shot and reloading. Without their help I would have been "okay". With their help I have steadly advanced.
Originally Posted by noone
We recently started a Field Precision Rifle category and I proudly put my Grendel up against the .338 Lapuas and .308 and don't look back. It is the confidence born of putting into practice what others were willing to teach.
Sorry for the dissertation, but I am a firm believer in folks learning how to handle fireams properly and proficiently.
Many asian people use the analogy of a cup of tea. The cup of tea represents your knowledge base. If you cup of tea (or knowledge base) is full, no one can put any more tea (or knowledge) into it. You must first empty your cup before anyone can put more into it. If you already think you know it all, your cup is full, and all the wisdom in the world will be lost if someone tries to teach you. Empty your cup first.