A New Build

[joker31]

that bronze color is beautiful, it even makes evil black look good

[bwaites]

burnt Bronze!

That was the original plan, but I think I want a little more orange in it.

[Walter]

I was at Marks shop today and saw his upper and lowers they are very nice. Machining is perfect. They are a very dark finish. You can see dead people in them.

[NugginFutz]

I was at Marks shop today and saw his upper and lowers they are very nice. Machining is perfect. They are a very dark finish. You can see dead people in them.

"Now, THAT's funny - I don't care who you are..."

[bwaites]

"Now, THAT's funny - I don't care who you are..."

And its a perfect description of the coating.

[bwaites]

No accuracy testing yet, that might happen next weekend, but I have done some velocity testing. I was able to test my 3 Grendel/Variants. My16 inch is discussed above. My 20” has a cut rifled Satern barrel seen in the “masterpiece”thread, and my 28” is one of the few 28” Grendels out there, with a cut rifled Satern barrel on a complete AA billet set.

I started with Hornady factory ammo. It fits and extracts from all three chambers without difficulty, as do all the other rounds tested.

Chronometer is a Competitive Edge Dynamics M2 set at 15 feet from the muzzle, with the latest version of software. Velocities are NOT muzzle velocities, but actual velocities at 15 feet. All velocities are listed in ascending order, not in the actual order they were recorded. There were no back to back duplicate velocities. There were a total of 8 error messages during the testing. The wind was blowing at 8-15MPH and this affected the screens at times, so I believe most of the errors were secondary to that issue. When an error occurred, the following shot was recorded. Factory velocities are from from the same box of ammunition for each rifle. Hand load velocities are from the same batch of handloads, using the same lot of powder and primers. Primers in hand loads are CCI 450 Small Rifle Magnum. Weather was 40-45 degrees, mostly sunny. Humidity of 60%. Altitude 1275 feet. Winds of 8-15 MPH.

Hornady Factory Amax

28”-2654, 2660, 2664, 2666, 2688. ES 34FPS AVG Vel 2666
20”-2458, 2459, 2461, 2470, 2480. ES 32FPS AVG Vel 2466
16”-2433, 2440, 2444, 2458, 2469. ES 36FPS AVG Vel 2448

Alexander Arms 123 Lapua Scenar

28”-2632, 2646, 2664, 2678, 2679. ES 47 AVG Vel 2660
20”-2509, 2514, 2517, 2518, 2531. ES 22 AVG Vel 2518
16”-2384, 2386, 2387, 2388, 2393. ES 9 AVG Vel 2388 Factory ammo with an ES of 9 for 5 shots!

THE FOLLOWING ARE HAND LOADS CAREFULLY DEVELOPED IN MY RIFLES. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES SHOULD YOU START AT THESE LOADS!!!! THESE ARE NOT STARTING LOADS!!!!

This is the most accurate 100-500 yard load in my 28” rifle.

107 Sierra 28.5 grains XBR 8208 2.26 COAL

28”- 2692, 2702, 2714, 2716, 2724. ES 32 AVG Vel 2710
20”- 2608, 2633, 2642, 2645, 2652. ES 44 AVG Vel 2636
16”- 2482, 2482, 2490, 2513, 2530. ES 48 AVG Vel 2499

100 Berger 29.5grains XTerminator 2.26 COAL

28”- 2848, 2850, 2852, 2856, 2866. ES 18 AVG Vel 2854
20”- 2769, 2782, 2785, 2797, 2797. ES 28 AVG Vel 2786
16”- 2635, 2641, 2646, 2647, 2659. ES 24 AVG Vel 2646

[Drifter]

Hornady Factory Amax

20”-2458, 2459, 2461, 2470, 2480. ES 32FPS AVG Vel 2466
16”-2433, 2440, 2444, 2458, 2469. ES 36FPS AVG Vel 2448

Interesting how the 16" and 20" barrel velocities are so close with factory Hornady Amax 123's, but a more expected difference with the other ammo.

[bwaites]

Interesting how the 16" and 20" barrel velocities are so close with factory Hornady Amax 123's, but a more expected difference with the other ammo.

I was really surprised at that.

Although other loads seemed to demostrate reasonable changes, that load was very surprising. After reviewing those results, I'm going to repeat them next time I do velocity testing.

The lesson here is that powders and bullets behave very differently in different barrels!

[NugginFutz]

I've heard that the BHW poly's run a little faster, but without the aid of short throats. Something to do with the 3R polygonal tube.

With 28 Gr 8208, my 22" BHW runs a 123 gr A-Max's at ~2570 fps

Temp: 51'F

2575, 2554, 2574, 2577, 2559, 2573, 2576, 2559, 2577, 2571

Avg: 2569 fps
ES: 23 fps
SD 8.7 fps

This load is near max, though, as another .2 grains bumps me to 2600.

I am, however, impressed with the ES your 16" delivered with those Scenars. Works out to an SD of 3!

[bwaites]

I've heard that the BHW poly's run a little faster, but without the aid of short throats. Something to do with the 3R polygonal tube.

With 28 Gr 8208, my 22" BHW runs a 123 gr A-Max's at ~2570 fps

Temp: 51'F

2575, 2554, 2574, 2577, 2559, 2573, 2576, 2559, 2577, 2571

Avg: 2569 fps
ES: 23 fps
SD 8.7 fps

This load is near max, though, as another .2 grains bumps me to 2600.

I am, however, impressed with the ES your 16" delivered with those Scenars.

Shocked me !

[bwaites]

Spent about 3 hours at the range today working on accuracy testing with the 16" BHW .264 LBC. Winds were light 5-8 MPH, and temps were low 50's.

I basically took samples of all the loads I have worked up over the last 6 years that worked in any of my Grendels. (Worked meaning less than 1 MOA in at least 1 rifle.)

My two base loads were the AA123 Scenar and the Hornady Factory AMAX. Both shot sub-MOA at 200 yards with 5 shot groups. These are both loads that have been proven to be effective in MANY rifles so I expected these results.

As many know, the .264 LBC really was designed for use with the Hornady AMAX and the 123 SMK in mind. I fully expected loads with those two bullets to shoot well, and suspected the Scenar would too. This proved to be the case. All three of those bullets shot SUB MOA with my handloads as well as the factory loads at 200 yards.

Using my 1-6 Vortex at 450 yards I was able to hit 8" steel consistently, and found that the AA 123 Scenar load was the most consistently accurate. I could move the shots around on the steel simply by shooting a box moving the scope turrets 1MOA at a time. Using the Scenar load, this was no problem at all staying on steel. This load had a very low ES in my rifle when I tested velocities last week, and after today, I'm convinced that was no fluke. Factory Hornady was minimally worse, while my handloads allowed me hits 80-90% of the time. I am amazed at the AA factory load.

However, lighter bullets did not fare as well. I could not get any load under 120 grains to shoot less than 2 MOA. Unfortunately, I did not have any 108 Scenar loads with me. The 108 and the 123 are the same bullet; except for weight, all the dimensions are the same. I am very interested in seeing if that long but lighter bullet will come close to matching the 123 performance.

I also did not play much with the Nosler 120 BT, which has shot well in all my Grendels. I did shoot 5 rounds into a group just over 1 MOA, but that was toward the end of my testing and I really think I need to revisit that bullet as well.

As expected, the LBC chamber shoots the longer, heavier bullets better than the shorter, lighter ones, at least today.

This does cause me great concern for those who have issues with their Stoner/Liberty barrels and will have their throats changed to a more conventional shape, as I would assume those barrels will more closely approximate the LBC than anything else. In that case, I would expect that they might very well shoot the heavier bullets better than the lighter ones.

Now that I have some idea of what bullets will work, I will swap to a high powered scope and try to shoot some groups, using the best of the loads from today.

[Tedward]

Very good report. I am planning to get a 20" Liberty barrel and have it reamed to the new throat just to see if that's the case. As cheap as the barrels are, it is worth the money to me to investigate. I really want to know if the different reamer will benefit in any way for the heavier bullets as you are seeing today with the LBC.

Thanks for the information, very informative.

[bwaites]

Very good report. I am planning to get a 20" Liberty barrel and have it reamed to the new throat just to see if that's the case. As cheap as the barrels are, it is worth the money to me to investigate. I really want to know if the different reamer will benefit in any way for the heavier bullets as you are seeing today with the LBC.

Thanks for the information, very informative.

I don't think its a benefit with heavier bullets. I can shoot groups that are at least as good with those bullets from both my Grendels. I can also shoot 130 grain bullets really well in both of them. I haven't tried 140's, because I can't get any decent velocity out of them loaded to max mag length (2.300") And it certainly is a detriment when you want to switch to light varmint bullets!

The issue is clouded a bit by the 3R polygonal rifling of the BHW barrels too. I think I can run higher charges in it than in the traditional rifled barrels, but I haven't experimented there yet.

[45r]

Very impressive looking rifle.
The upper and lower machine work is excellent.
I think I'm going to get some 123 grain scenars.

[bluebird]

Looks great