Anyone come up with a action Cycling Subsonic Load yet

[dega37]

Anything ever come of this?

I found these at midway http://www.midwayusa.com/product/199...oint-box-of-50

[txgunner00]

I'm still working on getting my hands on bullets designed for sub sonic use. Hurricane Sandy delayed the bullet maker a bit.

I have looked at those bullets but haven't tried them. They are pretty pricey and my guess is they won't perform any different than the Hornady 160's. They list the minimum impact velocity at 1900 fps.

[Variable]

Yeah, the Woodleighs are nice pills, but expensive and definitely wouldn't expand at all. We can shoot cheaper Hornady 160's without expansion now.

Tex: I'm still standing by. I figured I'd not pester you. You just say when, and your preferred form of payment will be in route ASAP.

[txgunner00]

PM sent.

[txgunner00]

The bullets came in from Hawk Custom Bullets. They are much softer than the Hornady 160s but look very similar.



I can load the Hornadys to mag length. These I had to set back to 2.155 avg OAL.



Loaded into a 7.62 x 39 mag.

[txgunner00]

I pulled my ballistic gel out of the fridge and it was partially frozen. It old and needs to be scrapped anyway but I still shot it.







The bullets didn't expand but seem to yaw fairly well.

[txgunner00]

Brass came out fairly clean for suppressed and formed about like it should.

I recovered two bullets from the frozen portion of the gel and they were only slightly deformed.





I was hoping for expansion but still no luck. I might try drilling some and possibly installing a polymer tip. I just have to wait a while before I make another batch of gel. My wife wasn't too happy about the first one.

[TxAggie94]

Hawk custom

Tx, I assume the reason you had to seat these deeper is that you were getting contact with the lands. Is that to say the Hawk bullets retain full diameter farther out? I am still having issues getting the case to hang on to the hornadys when I get them that deep. I am considering trying the woodlieghs to see if they hold better.

[txgunner00]

Tx, I assume the reason you had to seat these deeper is that you were getting contact with the lands. Is that to say the Hawk bullets retain full diameter farther out? I am still having issues getting the case to hang on to the hornadys when I get them that deep. I am considering trying the woodlieghs to see if they hold better.

That is correct. I don't have any problem seating the Hornady bullets to magazine length. I experimented with shorter OALs to see if they produced lower extreme spreads and better groups. For me the ES were about the same across the lengths but the groups got much better with the longer OALs. I don't have my data book for the exact length but I believe my OAL to the lands is longer than mag length in my rifle. Shouldn't be that much difference between chambers.

Are you sure you have .264 bullets and not .268?

[JASmith]

Apologies in advance for two major thoughts in a single post:

First, I know from my own experience with lead bullets in pistols that getting expansion at 1000 ft/sec and below is a challenge. 44 cal bullets cast from wheel weights did not when I shot a lot of jackrabbits as a young gentleman.

A good thing to try is a soft cast bullet at the lower velocity. The caliber doesn't absolutely have to be .264 and the firearm could even be a pistol. The important thing is to determine whether you can get the bullet to expand.

I am reasonably sure that commercial cast bullets will not expand since they use alloys that have yield strengths on the order of 15,000 psi. You, a buddy, or one of our forum participants might need to cast a few with either pure lead or the minimum practicable alloy to get the strength down.

I would start with water as the medium and use gel to verify your findings.

******

If the cast bullet expands at your velocities, I would then suspect the jacket is be too thick in the nose region. Getting thinner jackets might be problematic.

The easiest solution is to ask Hawk to start with shorter jackets with the thinnest available walls so you get more lead exposed at the nose. Too much exposed lead, of course, might lead to dinged noses.

I wonder if Hawk would be able to work with you and arrange for scoring or slitting the jacket over the first 25% of the jacket length.

I can visualize a die to do that with probably one added step in the swaging process.

Another alternative would be to ask them to apply a chamfer to the inside of the jacket so the wall is about 20% of the original thickness where the exposed lead starts and gets to full thickness just behind where the ogive starts. This is more labor intensive and possibly not a better solution.

******

Other, more complicated, solutions like deep hollowpoints or large diameter plastic tips can be tried but...

[txgunner00]

I did discuss a few options with Hawk for custom designs including some heavier bullets. These are his standard design and have soft annealed pure copper jackets. I plan to call him again and discuss the next step when I have time.

I have also considered soft cast lead bullets but have some concerns with how they will function in this rifle. Plus I don't have any casting equipment or any experience casting. I'm willing to give it a try if someone is willing to partner up.

[txgunner00]

I thought I would bump this up. I haven't had time to do any more testing but I did shoot some last weekend with a suppressor.

http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthread.php?6425-Suppressed-sub-sonic-short-video&p=64234#post64234

[tcte]

have any more news on this? think im gonna start trying with my 10.5" grendel with AAC can

[Nukes]

Depending on the intended quarry, I would expect that yaw and tumbling would obviate any need for expansion of subsonic 6.5 projectiles.

[txgunner00]

Depending on the intended quarry, I would expect that yaw and tumbling would obviate any need for expansion of subsonic 6.5 projectiles.

This is what I saw in my "redneck" testing. I don't think expansion is possible without some type of exotic material. Maybe a fracturing bullet like Lehigh makes is possible but it would be difficult with the relatively small diameter.