6.5 Grendel Preferred Loads

[AR-180]

This one is a Grendel. I am working up loads for it.



These averaged out to be 1.1386". I was using 123gr Noslers with 28.3 and 28.5 of IMR-8208.



These averaged out to be 1.157". I was using 123gr Noslers with 28.0 of IMR-8208.

I am just getting this gun together. I will spend some more time tweaking these loads. But, these do seem to show a lot of promise. I think a slicker trigger would have tightened the groups some.

[LRRPF52]

What range were those groups shot at? Nice rig, BTW.

[AR-180]

The groups were fired at 100 yards. I have a few of my other rifles really figured out. The Grendel is the next one I am going to get squared away.

[stokesrj]

[stokesrj]

Bob-
Since you've indicated in the past that the attention to details in the loading process is a contributor to your consistently positive results, do you find runout and/or neck concentricity factors to same or best addressed in die setup? I'm more than occasionally frustrated with wide disparity of one or both, even when trying to pay particular attention when sizing brass. Using Redding FL comp dies with 288 bushing. Some runout .001 or less, the next piece can be out by .005, without any seeming variation in technique. Your comments welcome.

Hi Bobke,
I was going back over this thread as I begin to firm things up and noticed I had not answered your question. I have never correlated runout to a degradation of accuracy at any distance less than 300 yards. Up to .003" of runout is acceptable even at 1,000 yards but even at that distance .005 will not put you out of the ten ring.
I'm using the same dies as you and quit measuring runout because I never find any exceeding .003" using Lapua or AA brass. I did see greater using Wolf brass and just tossed it all away as useless. In other calibers I do see a higher variation in runout. I have one of the Hornady case concentricity gauges and simply straighten them up. So, I'm a little perplexed why you would be seeing as much runout as you are. But at 100 yards it really is not a factor.
Bob

[AR-180]

I got a chance to head to the range today with the girlfriend. She suggested we go since the weather was nice. I grabbed a couple of Grendel uppers and what reloads I could cobble together. I figured I would test a few different loads with the bullets I still have while waiting for an order of 123 AMAXs. Both of the uppers had just been cleaned. So, it took a couple of groups for things to settle.

All the powder was IMR-8208. The bullets were 123 Noslers, 120 BTs and 100 BTs.

The barrels were a 28" and a 14.5". Since I was using two uppers and a few rounds, there was a lot of switching from bullet to bullet. Accordingly, there are a lot of groups here that the first shot goes into one area and the following shots cluster together but elsewhere.

The bottom three groups were 123s with 28.5gr 8208. They were seated shorter than I meant to get them. They were at 2.20". The top left was my girlfriend shooting this load. It started to come together. I saved a few of these to try with the second upper.

The top right was 27.5gr of 8208 with a Nosler 120gr BT. After the first shot, the rest clustered.



My girlfriend started the next target on the top right. She had an MOA group as a complete beginner. That closed out the 120s in the 28". Next, we went to the 100s. I think the bottom group on the left would have been good, but the girlfriend held off for four shots to try to hit the center. The best groups were fired with 30.0gr 8208 and the 100gr BT.



The final target was shot with the 14.5" barrel. The 123 Noslers with 28.5gr of 8208 did well. Both 29.0 and 30.0gr of 8208 did well with the 100gr Nosler BTs.

[Dogue]

Got a change to test out some loads this morning out of my 18" Shaw barrel and it still likes the hot loads...

All were loaded in previously fired Lapua brass and had CCI41 primers, 5 shot groups.

120 SMK's loaded to 2.20' and 123 Amax's to 2.250':
120 SMK w/28.5 8208 XBR,
Avg-2503, ES-19, SD-10.3
3 @ .5 moa but 2 others opened it up to 1.5 moa

123 Amax w/28.5 8208 XBR
Avg-2498, ES-57, SD-22.7 (4 of the loads had an ES of 16)
1.08 moa, 3 @ .271 moa

120 SMK w/31.0 CFE
Avg-2484, ES-55, SD-21.1
1.4 moa

120 SMK w/31.5 CFE
Avg-2543, ES-42, SD-15.2
1.5 moa but 4@.697 moa (I always have 1 that mess things up)

123 Amax w/31.0 CFE
Avg-2489, ES-85, SD-31.3
1.5 moa

123 Amax w/31.5 CFE
Avg-2522, ES-43, SD-18.5
4 @ .84 moa (1 flyer)

My rifle shots the 123 Amax load with 28.5 8208XBR as well as it does factory Hornady ammo, and it also seems to like 31.5 CFE223 under either the 123 Amax or the 120 Nosler BT. Primers were getting flat, no cratering, but for some reason the CFE loads caused a lot of FTE's where the next round did start to chamber but the fired round stovepiped. I might want to try a heavier buffer if I'm going to shoot more CFE (which is very likely).

[Deezil]

Velocitiy listed for 20" LW barrel.

120 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip – Overall Cartridge length = 2.225”

XBR 8208
28.0 gr – 2515fps,

Same load and bullet out of my 16" barrel at 100yds

[Daveworkslocal]

31.7 of BL-C(2) behind a 120 SMK with a FED205M primer seated at 2.20 netted me a sub 1" group at 200yds today at the range. I highly recomend this load.

[ferch]

In my 20" heavy barrel, 30g Winchester 748 behind either a 123g SMK or 123g Lapua Scenar in both Lapua and Hornady cases with a CCI 450 primer produces .5" groups for me consistently at 100 yards. The same load in the Wolf/PPU brass still produces .75" groups at 100 yards. I get fliers in both, but I'm new to precision rifles so I'm pretty sure the fliers are my error not the load.
For comparison, the Hornady factory ammo produces 3/4 to 1.25" groups for me at 100 yards. This factory ammo groups about 1" high and 1" to the right of my handloads.
I have a box of 123g AMAX bullets, and I haven't been able to get them to group under 1" with any of the powder I have tried. I've tried W748 and BLC2 (and maybe TAC orH335, but I don't have my notes with me). Sounds like I'm going to have to get some 8208 to use with them.

[Allen]

Well, I have some factory 123 AMAXs', 1 pound of IMR 8208XBR, 100 AA brass, 1000 CCI 450 primers, and 123 AMAX bullets and Hornady reloading dies in the mail.


Now I just need a barrel to push it though and I'll be set

[Von Gruff]

Yeah me to. I have factory Hornadies and all the required reloading gear on hand and I do have a barrel but the wait for the reamer seems interminable. A couple of weeks according the the last Mansons email but the one 10 weeks before that said about 6-8 weeks. GRRRRR and that dosent stand for Grendel this time.

[PrecisionFirearms]

Bill:

Simple. 120 Sierra Match King. Same load, same OAL. It will shoot as well as a person can hold from either chamber providing the barrel is of good quality.

Some loads using other bullets will shoot better but my bet is that they won't shoot equally well out of either chamber and they won't shoot equally well with almost any safe Grendel load. My bet is that a 120 will.

However, no commercial outfit will make money off of selling loaded ammo with a 120 Sierra as the bullet is not a "VLD". That part is marketing and I can't blame the manufacturers. No matter how good that bullet may be, if the ammo isn't marketed as a 'VLD', it won't sell.

LR1955

You are absolutely correct on the 120 Grain SMK. It is a very good bullet. I can personally attest to the accuracy from personal experience and from what customers are telling us. But when I try to market it, is moves slower than just about any other ammo we make. It just not racy enough. No hype, just plain gourmet vanilla results. No 1000 Yard Wins for sure, but for those looking for 600 and under distance, the 120 SMK should not be overlooked and is under appreciated. I found it will often outperform the 123 SMK in the 100-400 yard range. And it will do it in just about any rifle that I have tried and I have tried over 50 combinations of different lengths, profiles, brands, chamber clones, and temperatures. I have also found the 123 A-Max to be very forgiving and overall average for a VLD probably goes to it. The 123 Scenar can be very accurate, but is very particular and I haven't figured out what makes that thing tick. Just last week, I tested a Bartlein 24 inch Barrel, chambered in 6.5 Grendel and it shot .4 groups at 100 with the first 6 rounds with the first one a spotter round and not included. No cleaning between shots and no break-in. (Break-in is a conversation for another thread). I then fired 5 more, still with no break-in or cleaning. Still all five shots were under .4. I very happy with Bartlein barrels. During cleaning, it exhibited almost no copper fouling. I guess that is the purpose of 5R rifling. This test as done with 123 Grain Lapua Scenar in Lapua Cases, CCI 450, 28.3 gr 8208 XBR, COL 2.260-2.263. But I have seen this very load do 1.2 inch groups in another rifle that shot .6 with factory Hornady ammo. I don't know if it is possible to have a universal load that would shoot Sub .5 in all rifles. I haven't seen this happen in the 5.56 world either.

[stokesrj]

I don't know if it is possible to have a universal load that would shoot Sub .5 in all rifles. I haven't seen this happen in the 5.56 world either.

Try the Sierra 52 Match King and 26.5 grains of Winchester 748. I've seen ten consecutive AR's shoot .5 MOA ten shot groups, Wylde chamber, 20" Kreiger, Wilson, and Douglas barrels, 1:7, 1:7.7 and 1:8 twist. Similar results with 77 SMK and 24.0 grains Varget or R15 or 23.2 grians of IMR 8208XBR, all are .5 MOA or very close to it.

But that is not what I'm looking for here, I'm looking for loads that will consistently produce sub MOA out of most Grendels, I think that is possible.
Bob

[Maddmaxx]

This is a very interesting thread!! IMHO!! I'd like to throw something on the table though if I may! Some time back, a gentleman that is more educated at this than I stated that he likes to test his recipe's groups at 200yrds. This made sense because out of my particular Grendel, 120 NBT group sub-moa all day, but, I took that same load and hurl it at the 300 yrd mark and groups went between 5-7 inches. That was very disappointing! I put the 123 A-max's in front of some 2520 and they shot just as well as the 120s at 100 yrds but turned in sub-moa groups at 300 yrds, that was pleasant to see. Now that I have gotten a couple of whitetails to take a dirt nap at over 400 yrds with that load, I do agree with the 200yrd test groupings. Everything that I load for my rifles and my buddies' rifles get tested at the 200yrd mark.

This just my .02 worth~