Expected Grendel Pistol @100yd

[Wolfdog91]

Hello, so new guy here with a question.
I have a grendel AR pistol ( PSA 10.5" barrel upper on a Anderson lower and SBA brace) and wanted to know what is a reasonable expection for performance at 100yd. I've been reloading for it and so far the best groups I've gotten is 5 shots in a group measuring 1.164" 100yd with 26.4 grains of varget and a 123gr Hornady ELD Match followed by 1.525" with 27.4 grains of varget.

So my question is for a 6.5 grendel AR pistol is this pretty good or should it do better ?
Hope this dosent sound stupid and appricate any advice

[A5BLASTER]

Sounds like your getting the best the gun can give you with handloads and your shooting technique.

If it had a top end barrel like a bartlien, lijia or kreiger then I would expect better.

But for rack grade I would say your probably getting all it will give you with that bullet.

Maybe it will like a diffrent bullet or powder

[lazyengineer]

A5blaster nailed it. You are getting the reality. Those 0.5 MOA photos you sometimes see... yea, that's not reality for a rack grade 10.5" rig run by a mortal. Also, I'm beginning to realize 6.5 Grendel isn't a precision round without a lot of tuning

[FRB6.5]

That is actually pretty decent performance with a PSA barrel and a powder that isn't considered ideal for Grendel use.

[Texas]

I agree with the horde. You do not mention the rest, and other techniques used during the session, the type of sights , etc.
With a short barrel you may want to consider a faster burning powder to increase velocity.
Additionally, barrel length does not affect accuracy much.

[Rosecrans1]

For a 10.5" five shot group at 100 yards using Varget as a powder, that really isn't bad! Especially out of a PSA barrel. You didn't mention your optics or if you had upgraded the trigger from typical mil-spec. (Ditching the mil-spec trigger when shooting groups is huge).
Your questions aren't stupid at all. You lose a lot of velocity in a short barrel and Varget isn't great at pushing the Grendel in longer barrels as Texas stated above though my accuracy is definitely affected by a shorter barrel!
If you haven't tried different powders better suited to the Grendel, you haven't yet explored what the little PSA barreled gun can do. AR Comp, CFE223, 8208XBR, etc. There are many powders better suited than Varget. You may have better luck with a lighter bullet as well. Good Luck!

[Bigs28]

I would not expect that good of results out of a 10.5" psa upper. Congrats.

[NugginFutz]

Wolfdog91,

You don't mention optics (irons?), or your shooting position (offhand/bag/bipod/bench/prone) or under what conditions you shot (wind/cold/calm), so that makes it a little difficult to assess your results objectively. That said, you are reporting results similar to those I very often hear on the board from people with 16" and greater barrels and Carbine/Rifle setups. I'd say; "No worries!".

On a separate note, Texas is correct in suggesting a more optimized powder. Varget, while known for its consistency and temperature stability, is not the ideal powder for the Grendel. The case just doesn't have enough volume for Varget to develop velocities comparable to other powders, such as CFE223, AR-Comp, IMR8208XBR (for lighter pills), etc.

Unless Varget is the only powder available to you, I would recommend following Texas' lead and choose a power more suited for your setup.

(Of course, should you need to dispose of the balance of your Varget reserve, I would be more than happy to take it off your hands. )

[Wolfdog91]

Wow, first thanks for all the warm responses, yall seem like a really nice group of folks.

As far as my setup to a fuller extent. I'm usually shooting off a bench at the range. Most of the time with this pistol it's being shot wth a front and rear bag or a bipod and rear bag. Tried to shoot on daily calm days as far as wind goes, so never more than 5 miles an hour. I try to do that when testing all my reloads. The scope is a Simmons 3-9 mil mil scope ( with buy the way for a $100 Wal-Mart scope it tracks pretty dang well, not as good as my SWFA but still better than alot of others lol ). The trigger is much lighter than n average mil spec, I'd say 2.5 pounds which is pretty light for me. And on my trigger wanted to know what would cause my trigger pin to walk out every 15 or so shots?

I do have some 8208xbr but I don't think it the me any real good groups. I'd have to look through my notes again though and check

[VASCAR2]

I suspect the hammer spring legs are not setting in the grooves in the trigger pin. Not an uncommon occurrence for a hammer spring which is not orientated correctly. The legs of the hammer spring resting in the grooved trigger pin normally retains the trigger pin. The Geissele G2S trigger uses an e clip and if not used the hammer pin will move out on recoil.

I bought a PSA 12” pistol kit and with the mil spec trigger and 1-6 Strike Eagle I couldn’t get decent groups. I installed a RRA NM trigger I had in my parts bin. I pulled the 1-6 scope and used a 2.5-10-44 scope and I was finally able to get consistent 1-1.5 inch groups at 100 yards if I did my part. The AR-15 pistols are harder for me to shoot accurately compared to my other 16”, 18”, or 20” AR-15’s.

There are picture of AR-15 hammer and triggers with the springs in the correct orientation in the link.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Assemble_your_own_LOWER__UPPER__FREE_FLOAT__TRIGGER__GAS_BLOCK___Step_by_step_instructions_/4-226782/?

[StoneHendge]

I'd say your doing very good. I personally can't build a solid enough position, get consistent cheek placement and manage recoil well enough with a pistol stabilizer to get better than MOAish with a pistol. It may be possible to set everything up to get sub MOA off a bench, but pistols aren't for bench shooting.

[sharpshooter33]

I didn't know PSA had a 10.5" grendel barrel?
Anyway, I have a PSA 12" barrel upper and I get ok groups with it for my eyes. I expect its around a little over MOA or in the same area as yours over 1" but less than 2" at 100 yards. I've not cooked any handloads with it, but Hornady Black gives those results.
As for barrel length vs accuracy....This will get some arguments here, but shorter barrels are more accurate than long barrels of the same diameter. It has to do with harmonics of the barrel as it fires. The barrel at the end doesn't move as much as the longer barrel. But the velocity is why longer barrels are wanted. To reach out and touch something or the flbs when they hit.
A 10.5" and a 24" should both shoot 100 and 200 about the same accuracy at that distance. If everything is the same in both the 10.5 might be a little noticeably accurate, but your talking on a solid rest in a closed environment.
OK guys blast away.
SS33