Pistol upper legal to own?

[SDW]

^^^ Exactly. Goes beyond Federal law on many issues. Most magazines are famously verboten here. Can't own a suppressor, or full-auto anything, tax stamp or not (unless you're a movie studio, a PD, or just really rich). Many types of rifles and pistols are considered WMDs. Even many kinds of knives have been banned here---things I used to pay for and walk out of a hardware store with when I was just a kid.

[Misfit71]

If you look at what the atf is doing on form 1 suppressors, rejecting form 1 apps for silencer builds, even with submitters who stated they have no parts as yet - just a plan. They also pretty well see anything as a silencer even though you cannot use a singular part nor a solvent trap without work to make a functional silencer - so they are rejecting even a form 1 no matter the criteria, having barstock is enough to have a silencer as it was intent - or some such logic

With their (un)logical asinine reasoning - it won't be long before its decided owning a regular 16" AR could be intent of an SBR (implied by cutting barrel, crown etc) which would equate to their asinine thought of a solvent kit and even the individual parts like a cone being a silencer itself which logically it cannot (semantics right) - which I agree most buying solvent plan to convert them but hence the reason for a Form 1 submittal. I for the record wanna see the atf put together a solvent kit and shoot through it as is, parts as they come in a kit - BOOM... see dipsticks - its NOT a silencer.

Ultimately its all perception and semantics

For my part I have a lower pistol to match an upper that is less than 16" - they are together and I don't keep any extra short barrels to save the trouble so any intent for an item could be up to the judgement of others including the atf who IMO would rather lock up a otherwise law abiding citizen who tries to follow every letter of the law than do actual crime work - the atf is just political paper pushers with an agenda practicing lawfare - which is a shame as the very people that typically deal in NFA type items are very LEO/MIL supportive yet they try to be the arch nemesis of the very people that would typically support and appreciate them the most - makes no sense

/now ask me how I really feel

[outbreaker]

Realize that the ATF interprets things with "Constructive Intent" and prosecutes with that interpretation.

If you have an upper with less than a 16" barrel with no pistol lower to put it on they will interpret that to mean you have the intent to place it on the rifle upper you own and bingo.....it is an SBR even if it is not attached.

[LRRPF52]

Realize that the ATF interprets things with "Constructive Intent" and prosecutes with that interpretation.

If you have an upper with less than a 16" barrel with no pistol lower to put it on they will interpret that to mean you have the intent to place it on the rifle upper you own and bingo.....it is an SBR even if it is not attached.

[LRRPF52]

[outbreaker]

You are correct about the pistol brace cases, which is why they are changing the definitions.

Notice I was laying out the case of owning a short upper and a rifle lower when you DO NOT own a pistol lower. More than one person has been put in jail over that scenario.

The NFA has to go. All of it was both arbitrary and capricious.

[SDW]

Notice I was laying out the case of owning a short upper and a rifle lower when you DO NOT own a pistol lower. More than one person has been put in jail over that scenario.

Yep, that's what I was talking about earlier in this discussion. See post #12. It could be a problem where I live.

[CMoor]

Hi all, just wondering about the legal liabilities of having a pistol upper or two in the "to be built" pile.
I have a few complete rifle length gas builds completed and also have a pair of nice lightweight 16" barrels by BCM and Faxon, receivers, A2 stocks etc in the "to be built pile".
Should I just build the lowers install the pistol uppers and take pics and then call it good?
Currently my shortest barrels are 18". Never really got into the whole fireball of doom and blast from the pistol uppers that I have seen but I do concede they might have their place.
So the basic question is: Would a pistol upper in a house that contains complete and incomplete firearms be in any danger of being considered a SBR?
Thanks for your help.

Why are you even worried with a 16 in. barrel? That is a rifle not a pistol. SBR is less than 16 inches.

[ike838]

Why are you even worried with a 16 in. barrel? That is a rifle not a pistol. SBR is less than 16 inches.

I was not worried about the 16" barrels. Just examples of parts I have on hand.
I am considering getting a pistol upper to add to the pile as well.
I have two unbuilt lowers that were transfered as "Other".
As I stated earlier I will just build one of those with a brace, buy the pistol upper and take a few pictures to avoid any gray areas.

[outbreaker]

I was not worried about the 16" barrels. Just examples of parts I have on hand.
I am considering getting a pistol upper to add to the pile as well.
I have two unbuilt lowers that were transfered as "Other".
As I stated earlier I will just build one of those with a brace, buy the pistol upper and take a few pictures to avoid any gray areas.

With the new pistol brace rulings not finalized I would not have a brace on the pistol but just a buffer tube.

[ike838]

Point taken. Thank you.

[SDW]

I am considering getting a pistol upper to add to the pile as well.
...
As I stated earlier I will just build one of those with a brace, buy the pistol upper and take a few pictures to avoid any gray areas.

Again, no such thing as a "pistol upper". It's just an upper with a short barrel (by legal def, under 16"). Especially if it's something that's just to "add to the pile"---of other uppers presumably. May as well start using the correct terminology at this point of the thread.

[ike838]

Again, no such thing as a "pistol upper". It's just an upper with a short barrel (by legal def, under 16"). Especially if it's something that's just to "add to the pile"---of other uppers presumably. May as well start using the correct terminology at this point of the thread.

I know the terminology. That is why I am considering building a pistol.
A SBR is another kettle of fish.
Why do companies sell pistol uppers and weapons if there is "no such thing"?
For me it would be a toy. No day to day practical use for me.

Side note SDW. Didn't think having spare build parts on hand was unusual. To each their own.

[Bigs28]

An upper is just an upper. It's the lower that determines if it's a pistol or rifle.

[outbreaker]

I know the terminology. That is why I am considering building a pistol.
A SBR is another kettle of fish.
Why do companies sell pistol uppers and weapons if there is "no such thing"?
For me it would be a toy. No day to day practical use for me.

Side note SDW. Didn't think having spare build parts on hand was unusual. To each their own.

Having them is not unusual. You just have to make sure you have a non-NFA way to assemble them otherwise the ATF will assume you are assembling an NFA item.

Remember that the ATF has no problems killing your dog, you and your family to enforce its laws.