Reduced load fun with Howa Mini

[Robert8904]

I take three rifles to the 100 yard range so I can have something to shoot while the others are cooling off. It's always fun to try odd reloads in one of the guns. Yesterday I took the 6.5 Grendel Howa with some reduced loads.

Reduced load data is near nonexistent for this cartridge. I've tried Trail Boss, it works ok but is maybe too mild. I found a formula to use AA5744. This powder is commonly used for cast bullet rifle loads. I made up a ladder with 11.0-12.5 grains with 123 SMK's at 2.300" OAL. Book pressures run generally in the 15,000-30,000 range so I was able to use small pistol primers, conserving my dwindling supply of small rifle. Velocities should be in the 1,500- 2,000 fps range.

The results were a nice surprise. Ten groups of 4 shots each were between 3/16-5/8", actually better than this rifle does with normal loads. Muzzle blast and recoil were pretty mild and the barrel heated slowly. Cleanup was a snap.

I put DIP bottom metal and an old Nikon 3X12 scope on this Mini. It's light, compact, accurate and total fun to shoot.

[tdbru]

back when most shooters/hunters only had one rifle, maximizing it's utility was common. now folks just buy a different rifle for each task. or so it seems. anyway, yes, reduced loads are a hoot, much quieter, very little wear & tear on the rifle, etc. and for small game hunting, work great. several folks carry some reduced loads when out big game hunting, particularly in remote areas, for small game for the pot. could work for the AR platform too, if you don't mind cycling the action by hand. for reduced loads for small game hunting for the pot, that shouldn't be a big deal as you probably won't be shooting reduced loads in volume anyway. a bolt rifle makes it much easier as you noted. if you look up data for cast bullets, these are generally reduced loads. as long as you're not working with or near the minimum cast bullet level you probably could substitute jacketed bullets of the same weight. but jacketed bullets engraving friction and force are quite a bit higher than cast bullets, so if you're working near the bottom loads for cbs, you run a real risk of sticking the jacketed bullet in the bore of the rifle.

Hodgdon publishes reduced jacketed bullet loads with both trailboss and H4895. both are very easy to ignite and burn. reduced loads with ball powders are generally not recommended because of the heavy deterrent coating on the ball powder, to control burn rate, which makes them much harder to ignite. you run the risk of secondary explosive effect with reduced loads of ball powders. you'll note most cast bullet loads use pistol powders (bulky and easily ignited at low loading densities) or some of the faster rifle powders in addition to the previously mentioned AA5744. IMR use to make a powder that was specifically designed for reduced rifle loads called SR4759. they dropped it a decade or so back due to low demand. seems very few people are interested in reduced loads anymore.
-tdbru

[Robert8904]

I've been using the Lyman cast bullet manual for most reduced loading. I just sub a jacketed bullet and stay away from max loadings. The best accuracy is almost always in the lower to mid loadings anyway. One minor problem with reduced loads is there's often not enough pressure to fully form the cases to the chamber so the brass' headspace datum is actually shortened maybe .002-.003", probably from getting smacked by the firing pin.

I have used reduced loads only in bolt actions till a few days ago. I just got a new M1A Springfield Standard. Just for fun I tried some 308 reduced loads (168SMK/ 22.5 5744 @ 2.810"). Figured I'd have to close the gas off and hand cycle it but it cycled just fine and dropped the brass right on the bench These loads are in only around 1800 fps and pretty accurate.

[kmon]

AA5744 and H3895 are great powders for reduced loads. They can be a lot of fun

5744 data at one time was seems like much more available. At oen time there were loads published for it that you could basically turn your 300 Win Mag into t 30-30.

H4895 Hogdon has instructions for using it in any cartridge that it is listed for on their manual for reduced loads as if Trail Boss powder https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/rel...w-recoil-loads

[Stinky Coyote]

what would velocity be like out of ruger ranch 16" barrel, anyone chrony this, subsonic potential maybe heavier boolits?

[Oso Polaris]

Trailboss is a popular powder for loading traditional black powder cartridges (rimmed rifle cases) and also subsonic 300BO. It is a very clean burning powder. The powder is designed to be bulky to replicate the larger case fill that traditional black powder would take up in old lever gun cartridges. As a result it is good option for subsonic... good case fill with lower powder volumes compared to spherical or stick powder,

There are some other powders that may deliver top accuracy (supersonic) without having to max out velocities.

[TacomptonMatt]

Handloader magazine had an article in the Feb-March 2017 issue that mentioned a formula for using 5744 for reduced loads.

[Lemonaid]

I tried out the max amount of 4350 I could fit with out compression in my fast twist 6PPC Rap. Accuracy was great, pleasant to shoot but velocity was about 400 fps lower than Lever or CFE 223.
It would be fun to see how it would work as a reduced load for 6.5 Grendel.

Nosler 105RDF, IMR 4350 25.8, CCI 400, Horn/Gren 6x, 2.260
2.260 2361,2361,2338 3=.217 SD=13.28 AVE 2353

[Oso Polaris]

I have more experience with 300BO and for that matter downloading revolver for some competition. Honestly, most shooters with 300BO just stick to H110 even for subsonics, especially with short barrels. With 9gr-10gr of powder and a 200gr bullet, there really isn't any empty space left in a 300BO or 125 gr TNT with 18gr powder is 2100fps out of 8" barrel.

This is a different story with the significant increase in case capacity of Grendel. I don't know of a powder that has greater case fill than Trail Boss. Maybe also consider stuffing a heavy 140gr-150gr bullet to eat up some case volume while staying supersonic so that AR15 still cycles.

[BD264]

I've played around with subsconic cast loads. 140g cast lyman boolet with Unique.

https://youtu.be/N-O7JFQcuwg

[Highbrow]

[Dinny]

Anyone have any experience with Viht Tin Star N32C? I've loaded it in 300BLK and 357 Maximum for sub loads but not the Grendel. QL is about the only source of data I could find and know better than to trust just one source.

Thanks, Dinny

[Brazz04]

[Fess]

Handloader magazine had an article in the Feb-March 2017 issue that mentioned a formula for using 5744 for reduced loads.

I came across that article the other day and managed to find some A5744.

https://www.handloadermagazine.com/reduced-rifle-loads

[Robert8904]

Yes, that was surely me. I love that 5744, I put that s**t in everything!