New Cartridge Developments and Implications for Dismounted Infantry Soldiers

[rickt300]

So we still need eco-friendly?

I agree, its tougher to do, but its still doable. In fact, a solid copper bullet would work. 180 grain Barnes with a BC or .473 can be loaded easily to 2700 FPS with easily available powders. Using the newer Superperformance powders, I'd bet you could get over 2800 out of them, at standard length.

Bumping to 200 grains loses several hundred feet per second, but is doable, with 2600 FPS velocities at standard length.

Eco friendly just cracks me up as we are talking about the imminent destruction of human tissue before and after the penetration of various barriers. That said Okinawa was literally covered with bullets fired in WWII, and this I saw in the 70's. Anyone ever hear anything about the ecosystem of Okinawa being damaged by large amounts of lead? When I was there most of the war damage had been grown over though there was still plenty of munitions to be found if you wanted to look.

[Popeye212]

Funny.

Can't use lead bullets anymore, but by god, we will litter the battlefield with plastic that will never ever corrode away.

Now you really can't expect em to think past the lead thing. Hey look what we got rid of the lead...yay us go green. Now despite the fact that as you said you are littering plastic all over the place that is GASP!! made with OIL!! Big oil profits again liberal heads explode. They just can't seem think very far ahead..God bless em...ROFL

[hill37]

This ammo seems to be ahead of Shell Shock cased rifle ammo. We should hear something about Shell Shocks .223 cases soon. If they are on schedule. The 9mm seems legit though.

[stanc]

Eco friendly just cracks me up as we are talking about the imminent destruction of human tissue before and after the penetration of various barriers. That said Okinawa was literally covered with bullets fired in WWII, and this I saw in the 70's. Anyone ever hear anything about the ecosystem of Okinawa being damaged by large amounts of lead? When I was there most of the war damage had been grown over though there was still plenty of munitions to be found if you wanted to look.

Now you really can't expect em to think past the lead thing.

<sigh> Apparently we can't expect some gun people to get past the lead thing, either.

1. The switch to lead-free bullets was never about concern over polluting the battlefield. It was about reducing pollution on US military firing ranges.
2. Lead-free M80A1 and M855A1 ammo delivers superior terminal performance in both soft and hard targets compared to lead-core M80 and M855.

Lead is not the best choice of material for bullets in general-purpose combat ammo.

[hill37]

what do you think the best material would be?

[stanc]

what do you think the best material would be?

Steel. It gives the best combination of cost, availability, performance, etc, and meets the requirements for lead-free construction.

But, if you're not limited to just one material, the two-piece (steel tip / copper slug) construction of the EPR bullet is hard to beat.

[BluntForceTrauma]

I like steel-tip, lead core. Both cheap and ballistically sound.

[VASCAR2]

Stan have you seen the new IMI armor piercing ammo? Doesn’t give much information.

http://www.imisystems.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/4.2.18_556APM_EN-design_Final.pdf

[hill37]

Why not keep improved 5.56 for magazine fed weapons? It seems most problems with it have been fixed. Like LRRP52 I think machine guns are the major problem. What about a light, constant recoil machine gun using 140 gr steel and aluminum long bullets? Combined with light cases and fairly high speeds ,how would it perform?

[stanc]

It sure doesn't. When I saw that IMI publicity sheet a few months ago, I searched for more info, but found nothing.

[hill37]

I tried to calculate the bc of a 30 cal 140 grain bullet with the form factor of the 200 gr match king. but my algebra has left me.

[hill37]

A new(?) face in the poly case fray? http://www.truevelocityinc.com/industries/