I have a 12" Grendel pistol I built using an SBA3 brace. If I convert it to a longer LOP using an A5 buffer tube will I need a different buffer weight and spring? If so, what should I look for in the replacement items?
A4 --> A5 Buffer Tube conversion
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Originally posted by A5BLASTER View PostIf you convert it, that is modifying it and in the eyes of the Fed's it's against the law.
Again.
Listen, and abandon your plan, unless you also plan to file a form 1 and wait for approval. I wouldn't take this chance, given the current way of things. Beware the fudds.Nothing kills the incentive of men faster than a healthy sense of entitlement. Nothing kills entitlement faster than a healthy sense of achievement.
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Originally posted by SKelt View PostDamn, didn't realize that the buffer tube was included within the brace modification limits. Would it still violate the law if I put a Law Tactical folder on the gun?
Appreciate the advice on this.
For what it's worth I started with the sba3 when I built my pistol grendel. Now I'm waiting on forums to clear. Screw a pistol brace, give me a real stock. I'm ok with paying a lil extra and asking please, that way I can have a more comfortable and contolable weapon.
Plus braces just look like crap.
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Originally posted by SKelt View PostDamn, didn't realize that the buffer tube was included within the brace modification limits. Would it still violate the law if I put a Law Tactical folder on the gun?
Appreciate the advice on this.
And damn it would be nice if the reduction of "Gray" areas would be clarified and not just changed on the whim of a field agent to benefit his/her own case.Last edited by Lastrites; 09-10-2019, 11:32 AM.
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Originally posted by Lastrites View PostThey will also measure the OAL with it folded which prevents the use of a vfg in most cases.
Read: Measuring the Overall Length of a Pistol? ATF has Altered the Deal from Adam Kraut on July 5, 2019 for Recoil.
Also SB tactical makes a LOP limiter if you are that concerned about it- https://www.sb-tactical.com/product/...-pull-limiter/
I say do what you want, they're gonna change their mind anyways. Latest word says the atf might even do away with braces soon and you will have to register or change the barrel anyways. Isn't it great when non elected officials can arbitrarily change their minds on something that will make you a felon?
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Originally posted by A5BLASTER View PostIf you convert it, that is modifying it and in the eyes of the Fed's it's against the law.
Using a different RET does not modify the brace, and increasing the LOP certainly doesn't violate any laws.
OP: If you use an A5 RET, you will need the corresponding A5 buffer, which is longer than a carbine, but shorter than a rifle buffer.
Also, if you install a Law folding adaptor, the overall measurement of the length of the pistol will be considered in the folded position.NRA Basic, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, RSO
CCW, CQM, DM, Long Range Rifle Instructor
6.5 Grendel Reloading Handbooks & chamber brushes can be found here:
www.AR15buildbox.com
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A5 on its own with SBA3 or 4 keeps the LOP under 13 1/2. If you are using a Law folding adapter with either RE you need to use the limiters linked above or fill in a hole with epoxy etc.
Also A5 requires a rifle length spring such as a Sprinco Green as well as the longer A5 buffer.Last edited by FRB6.5; 08-22-2019, 03:22 AM.
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I'll leave this here as it is a good read
Late yesterday, I received an email from an individual containing a letter from ATF which was a response to a correspondence requesting the correct method to “measure a firearm with a ‘…
Didn't want to click
Measure to end of buffer tube or if it folds, measure in folded position and the 13.5"lop is a thing.
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Originally posted by LRRPF52 View PostIf you modify the brace into a stock, or a device with a plug in the space where your arm goes, then they can and have prosecuted this (domestic violence call, threw in firearms charge and lost that case).
Using a different RET does not modify the brace, and increasing the LOP certainly doesn't violate any laws.
OP: If you use an A5 RET, you will need the corresponding A5 buffer, which is longer than a carbine, but shorter than a rifle buffer.
Also, if you install a Law folding adaptor, the overall measurement of the length of the pistol will be considered in the folded position.
If the brace is described to fit on a carbine buffer tube it must remain on a carbine buffer tube. Changing out the tube is considered a modification and illegal.
That's what local, sherriff, state trooper and ldwf game wardens have to say on the issue.
That's who I'm going with on the subject.
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The attachement I had added addresses buffer tubes to a point, atf points out that it only standard buffer tubes will be considered in OAL measurement and not a tube like the KAK supertube that has about an inch of superfluous material or so of solid space added to the end which does nothing but add length to extension. An A-5 or AR-10 tube which is longer than an AR15 tube but are fully functional may end up being another "gray" area which those are standard receiver extensions just not necessarily for an AR15. In the end any LEO can crack your nuts until they get themselves sorted out so you may beat the charge but you might take a ride.
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Originally posted by A5BLASTER View PostWhat I was told by law enforcement here in my state is this.
If the brace is described to fit on a carbine buffer tube it must remain on a carbine buffer tube. Changing out the tube is considered a modification and illegal.
That's what local, sherriff, state trooper and ldwf game wardens have to say on the issue.
That's who I'm going with on the subject.
The April 2017 Open Letter was pretty clear:
If, however, the shooter/possessor takes affirmative steps to configure the device for use as a shoulder-stock — for example, configuring the brace so as to permanently affix it to the end of a buffer tube…removing the arm-strap, or otherwise undermining its ability to be used as a brace — and then in fact shoots the firearm from the shoulder…that person has…”redesigned” the firearm for purposes of the NFA. – BATFE
IANAL and I agree that the regulations and back and forth changes are a silly game of "simon says". But my take away from the prince law link above, the freedom shop incident and now the Black Aces change has been more to steer people away from accidental or intentional AOW/SBS/SBR from the overly vague "Firearm" classification. The all seem to make it more clear that there is a definition of a modern "pistol". Due to ADA in my opinion braces won't be going anywhere and the recent actions seem to be protecting them in a way.Last edited by FRB6.5; 08-22-2019, 07:54 PM.
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