Scope cant question

[plain ol Bill]

Finished the 6.5 build, mounted the scope (Athlon 4.5-24 x50) and bore sighted it. Set the focal length to suit me and have a question guys. This is my first scope - fired one on a 7mm mag a friend had once and it left a nice cut in the eyebrow. That broke me of the scope habit! But the years have dimmed things down and can I see the iron sights or the target but can't see them both at the same time anymore it seems. So scope time. Now for the question:
When I throw the rifle to my shoulder it has a normal cant to the left of about 5 -10 degrees. Stock length is comfortable, my hand grip seems norma, and the rifle is comfortable. Of course the reticle is on a cant now. I presume I plumb the reticle to suit my normal head position instead of plumb to the rifle. Is this the right way?
Don't know if I'm asking this the right way - does it make sense?

[kmon]

Plumb it to the rifle

[ricsmall]

^^This^^

[Popeye212]

Plumb it to the rifle

What he ^^ said.

[LR1955]

PoB:

What the others said.

Don't worry about canting it in when you shoot standing, or seated, or kneeling, or any other unstable position. Yes, the bullet will go in the direction of the cant. And it won't matter in terms of all the other unsteadiness things going on. Chances are you will make a better shot because you will be more comfortable.

LR55

[grayfox]

And un-cant your head...
if you don't have a raised comb and a great cheek weld, maybe this is what's causing the slant? Others may have a better explanation for this...
Your head should be fairly straight, cheek resting on the comb (best IMO is bone-to-comb), eyes pretty level and shooting-eye in line with the centerline of the scope, at the eye relief distance (typically about 3.5-4" or whatever the scope manual tells you). Rifle vertical and scope's vertical cross-hair, well, vertical.
The scope won't knock your eye socket if your head, rifle stock, shoulder, arm and chest all act as a single unit, no flex, no rifle stock travel independent of your head/shoulder, that sort of thing.

[Klem]

Bill,

I agree with everyone, that the convention is to plumb the scope reticle/bore axis to gravity, but you can do what you are proposing provided you be aware of;

1. You must shoot your gun with exactly the same tilt of head every time, regardless of position; sitting, kneeling, standing, prone.
2. No-one else will be able to shoot it reliably unless they are shooting a target at the zero range, on a still day.
3. You will not be able to do this with a forward cant scope mount (e.g. 20MOA) .

Looking at it relative to gravity (we plumb scopes for gravity, not wind - wind is variable, gravity is constant);

Scenario A is the recommended way. The scope is plumb with the bore, and this axis is plumb with gravity...Perfect. We try and fit our body to this.
Scenario B is what happens to you if you plumb the scope the conventional way (A) and then lean into the gun. It tilts off axis and dialing elevation and windage will introduce angular moments that will confound their prediction and confuse the shooter.
Scenario C is what you are proposing...This will work for you (only). Elevation and windage are plumb to gravity and the offset barrel makes no difference.
Scenario D is what happens if someone else picks up your gun or you shoot untilted in any other shooting position.

.


As long as you accept that what you are proposing is eccentric and unusual but it will work.





.

[LR1955]

Bill,

I agree with everyone, that the convention is to plumb the scope reticle/bore axis to gravity, but you can do what you are proposing provided you be aware of;

1. You must shoot your gun with exactly the same tilt of head every time, regardless of position; sitting, kneeling, standing, prone.
2. No-one else will be able to shoot it reliably unless they are shooting a target at the zero range, on a still day.
3. You will not be able to do this with a forward cant scope mount (e.g. 20MOA) .

Looking at it relative to gravity (we plumb scopes for gravity, not wind - wind is variable, gravity is constant);

Scenario A is the recommended way. The scope is plumb with the bore, and this axis is plumb with gravity...Perfect. We try and fit our body to this.
Scenario B is what happens to you if you plumb the scope the conventional way (A) and then lean into the gun. It tilts off axis and dialing elevation and windage will introduce angular moments that will confound their prediction and confuse the shooter.
Scenario C is what you are proposing...This will work for you (only). Elevation and windage are plumb to gravity and the offset barrel makes no difference.
Scenario D is what happens if someone else picks up your gun or you shoot untilted in any other shooting position.

.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]14758[/ATTACH]

As long as you accept that what you are proposing is eccentric and unusual but it will work.





.

Sure will work.

My old Tubb 2K allowed for canting of the rail. The purpose was one of ergonomics when operating a bolt action rifle. I believe I could max it at 15 degrees. Was far more efficient to rapidly function the bolt while staying in position when the rifle itself was canted in to me. The optic or iron sights remained in the vertical plane when shooting. Just another very good feature on that rifle. Not hard for a gun maker to do, either.

Have also shot a standard rifle with optic mounted properly while canting the entire system. Tested it at a 600 practice. You really have to cant the rifle a lot to get the bullet to leave the ten ring at 600 with a center hold. Somewhere around 25 or so degrees if I recall correctly and the bullet goes a bit over a minute down and in the direction of the cant. Very difficult for me to get into a prone with that much cant on that particular rifle.

Anyway -- nothing stopping someone from testing it out for themselves.

LR55