Night Optics User Experience Thread...

[usar_ds]

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you.

I have used a PVS14 behind a variable magnification scope for a few years now. I have been doing this for so long I don't think ARMS makes the #29 PVS14 mount anymore (there are plenty of other choices however).


You have to focus the NVD first to the reticle and then focus the scope to the target, otherwise you get the 'grainy' outcome you experienced. As for less light as we crank up the scope, true, but if you have a manual gain NVD then hopefully there is some latitude to crank-up the gain to offset this. Eventually however you will hit max gain on the NVD and like your eye looking through a scope in daytime that variable becomes a fixed component of a variable system. Use artificial illumination like an IR torch and suddenly you have more clarity coming through the scope. I do not always use the torch however, especially on a bright night.

outstanding set up, glad to hear from someone that has experience using magnified day scope+nvd combo, your report on getting good results from this making me rethink how i am going to employ my atn unit.

although with the 5x objective i may still end up with it behind my reflex sight and just swap it out with my 3x magnifier when it gets dark.

but being able to swap the 5x objective for the 1x and then use it on all of my other rifles with magnified day optics could yield interesting results

[am4966]

I found a place that is supposed to have a great deal on the.
Armsight CO-MR Gen 2+ QS Medium range Clip on White Phosphorus. They say there distributors for armasight. Maybe they offer other armasight stuff.

Coyote Rifleworks I got my nfa trust from them. They where great to deal with for that. That's my only dealings.

[Drift]

Yes ! This is the kind of information I am looking for! First question to Klem " Would you please guess as to the make/kind of mounts you would use for mounting both a day scope (with 30mm tube and 50mm objective) to mate with the PVS14?"
2nd question to anyone. "whats the difference/advantage with the Phosphorus?"

[ricsmall]

hey guys, ive read thru the thread and am now totally unsure what to get. Long story short, the man I work for owns a large tract of land in south georgia and we just got invaded with hogs. My cousin has the same situation and has a vehichle mounted flir camera with viewing screen, and a flir rifle scope. Ive talked with several guys around here that have used one type and recommend the one they own. Make sense? Everyone ive talked to with one exception recommends the one they have. The other guy said buy one of each but thats not gonna fly with the owner,so, my question is this:

We will be trying to locate and shoot pigs in cover ranging from thick brush to open field/clearcut type cover. Ranges will probably be from 50-250 yds. money is an object but if we're gonna spend 15k for something good, we'll spend 20k for something much better/durable. Plan is to have on a grendel AR with lots of ammo!! BTW, ive heard also to use thermal for locating and GOOD NV scope for actual shooting??

I may have left out some pertinent details, so lemme kno if u need more info, and please fire away with the suggestions. I looked on optics planet at the flir, armasight, etc. and am unsure what to do here.

Any help is appreciated

Richard

[LRRPF52]

If you're going to use PVS-14 type tubes, MOD Armory has an awesome QD system that clips off the helmet and then attaches to the weapon very quickly, with a very minimal profile. It's a very slick system.

I personally am leaning to the thermals.

[customcutter]

hey guys, ive read thru the thread and am now totally unsure what to get.

Yes, I was in the same boat except I was in an inflatable ($1000), and your in a yacht ($15-20,000). Maybe, I'll sell a kidney one day and go thermal.

In all seriousness though, I did a lot of online research for what was in my price range. Then started reading the reviews. Also did a lot of youtube viewing, to see what type of image might be available. Finally ordered a 5X18 ATN X-sight, and 2 days later found a forum that included information that the 3X12 is 10oz less, and that the 5X is closer to 7X. So I've got 30 days starting tomorrow when it arrives to decide if I'm going to keep it or maybe return for a 3X12. Also I found out that there are some companies that will rent Night Vision equipment and apply the rental toward a purchase, if that sounds like an option. I don't know about multiple rentals though as far as applying toward a single purchase.

Some key questions you need to ask. Is it a weapon mounted system? If so does it retain zero, if removed and re-installed? Will it see only night use, or day and night??? Will you use one weapon for day duty, and another for night. I've already realized I'll still need some type of monocular for scanning.

Good luck and keep us updated.

[Drift]

I dont think thermals would be much use during gator season. I suspect the big lizards would be water temp and not stand out. CC look around on the "High Tech Redneck"site some. My idea is is to glass the fields some, maybe over a feeder for pig and the gut pile for coyotes with a monocular. Then move the monocular to the rifle. Most of us have daytime scopes we like, so why add another dedicated NV scope. I have many old daytime scopes I don't like, why do that again with night vision?

[ricsmall]

To update, I have a couple friends who are gonna plan us a thermal and NV Scope, so this should make the decision easier. My boss and I are leaning toward getting one of each, but we'll decide for sure after the demo of these two units. We feel a thermal with qd mount will do for scanning, that way we can reattach and have two guns blazing if the situation is right. The thermal is an ATN Thor 640 I think, and the NV is an armasight gen 3. Should be interesting. Will keep updated. Thanks for the input guys.
Richard

[customcutter]

Drift,

I agree, thermal won't be much good for big lizards. If I was going to hunt one it would probably be with a white lite, and a bow or crossbow set-up. That way I would have a line on him. I think the PVS-14 is a good set-up, just time consuming possibly, fumbling around in the dark trying to get the system set up is all. That's fine if you're up a stand. I wouldn't want to be on the ground looking for pigs with a monocular, when I round the corner, there's the boar in a bad mood. Not a good time to call time out. That's my only concern. It's good for a feeder or gut pile set up.

[customcutter]

Klem,

I'm not knocking the PVS14. Trust me, I don't know enough to know, that I don't know anything about NV.

I just received the X-sight, put batteries in and powered it up. It looks like about 3' FOV at about 30 yds. Way to tight IMHO for the type hunting I'm thinking of. Waiting for dark now so I can try it out with the 850mW illuminator that came with the unit. It's also every bit of the 2#7oz's.

[Double Naught Spy]

So would I if I could justify the price. Once you have a PVS14 and accept that it works it's hard to justify the extreme spend on something that will give you a better edge only in certain circumstances. If starting out from scratch I would be pulling my hair out wondering which path to take; thermal or image intensification.

It is amazing what you can see with a thermal that you cannot see with a PVS14. You can get by with a PVS14, but do so much more with a thermal.

[Double Naught Spy]

We aren't the military and we aren't kicking in doors in mud huts. Part of the reason the military does not use both is expense, not functionality. Also until recently, thermal units tended to be much larger than PVS14 units. That is now changing. I have seen fusion technology. It has its own problems. It isn't all good and no bad. It is also that much more expensive.

I hunt with guys who use PVS14 and my thermal scopes are usually better at both spotting animals and identifying animals at greater distances. What I consistently hear is, "What is that dark spot at about 150 yards over to the left...?" And I report back, "No heat signature."

PVS14 is great when you are out in the open under a starry night or nice moon, but sucks when it comes to finding animals like coyotes and bobcats running along the treeline in the shadows.

The bottom line here really is that the military mission is DIFFERENT than what we do as hunters. Frequent comparisons I see to "the military" and its use of technology are usually fraught with problems, primarily the fact that "the military" budgets to the lowest bidder or by government contract that is NOT based on what the soldiers in the field necessarily want and the equipment to be used has to be used by the most inexperienced grunt (AKA, Lowest Common Demoninator). Sure, if you want to fly your Little Bird or drive your Hummer around, you need a PVS14, no doubt, because thermal does not see through windows, but until I get that option, thermal ROCKS when it comes to hunting.

[rushmc1a]

Just thought I would let anyone who is interested (or waiting) that I heard from Armasight custormer service late yesterday.
They told me the Zeus Pro models are to start shipping this Friday!
I will let you all know when I get mine
It has been a long wait......

[am4966]

Just thought I would let anyone who is interested (or waiting) that I heard from Armasight custormer service late yesterday.
They told me the Zeus Pro models are to start shipping this Friday!
I will let you all know when I get mine
It has been a long wait......

Those pro models look pretty fing sweet! I think I'm going to have to put a nv/thermal on my wish list.

[rushmc1a]

Here is the one I have on order

https://www.armasight.com/thermal-imaging/thermal-weapon-sights/armasight-zeus-pro-336-4-16x50-60-hz

And the dvr is coming too