50/200 sight in

[A5BLASTER]

Ok gents got a question about sighting in iron sights on the ar15 platform.

Non of my ar's have ever had iron sights before, the lil 16 inch grendel I just built has leapers accusync flip up sights and will also have a at3 red dot as it's primary.

Been reading up on the 50/200 sight in process and had to wonder.

That sight in was thought up for the 223/556 caliber. So how well will it work with the grendel?

My gut tells me should be fine for the ranges I would be useing the iron sights but figured someone here would know for sure.

So what say the board 50/200 good to go are should I just zero it at 100 like I do all my scopes?

[Sticks]

If all your other rifles are zeroed at 100, and this rifle is a HD/SD designated hitter, best to stay with 100 as your mental process will be limited in a fight or flight situation, but should be able to manage hold over/under you would normally use.

[Klem]

A Grendel PBR will be different; because it is slower you require a closer first intersection and a further second intersection of the bullet with sight axis.

What is the diameter of your target, the velocity and type of bullet? Plug that into JBM to get your PBR.

[A5BLASTER]

Thanks for the reply gents.

The rifle will be a hd/sd gun as well as a spot and stalk thick brush and tree stand gun.

So the distances I would use the iron sights I'm thinking will be max of 100 yards, they will be back up to the red dot I'm going to use as primary.

The red dot I'm going to sight at 100 yards.

Sticks you make a good point about just sighting it at 100 like I do everything else.

What about doing a 25 yard zero with the iron sights?

[LR1955]

Thanks for the reply gents.

The rifle will be a hd/sd gun as well as a spot and stalk thick brush and tree stand gun.

So the distances I would use the iron sights I'm thinking will be max of 100 yards, they will be back up to the red dot I'm going to use as primary.

The red dot I'm going to sight at 100 yards.

Sticks you make a good point about just sighting it at 100 like I do everything else.

What about doing a 25 yard zero with the iron sights?

Point of aim / impact with a 25 yard zero will be between 250 and 300 yards.

Point of aim / impact with a 50 yard zero will be around 100 yards.

Probably the best way to find out is to measure 100 and 300 yards very precisely and get a zero for them. Then measure 25 and 50 yards and shoot the 300 and then the 100 yard zero on to the paper at 25 and 50 yards respectively.

Battlesight zero's are fine for battle but not fine for precision. Neither is anything made by Leapers. Can't believe you would buy Leapers sights. No way -- tell us it was to test our attention to detail in reading your post!

If it is a BUIS, you will be hard pressed to get a consistent zero at 300 because they are crude at best. Fine for Quick Kill stuff at 100 or closer but I doubt you will get a consistent zero with them at 300.

LR55

[mdewitt71]

Set it up, shoot it and find out for yourself- 1st hand, in your conditional environment.
As far as equipment; buy what you can afford and don't worry about the internet hype.....
Everyone is a couch commando keyboard ranger when it comes time to judge other peoples gear over the world wide web.
28 years, 15 OCONUS deployments (5 in OIF alone) I have seen expensive stuff break just as much as cheap stuff outlast the expensive stuff.
I highly doubt the OP is going to deploy with this setup anytime soon.
The most important thing is that you have a setup that you can afford to shoot and shoot it as often as you can afford.

[A5BLASTER]

Already got it sighted in did a 50 yard sight in.

Didn't have any trouble getting 5 shots at a inch with eld-m.

That should do fine for what I will be useing the iron sights for.

Rifle was sighted off bags and bench.

LR1955, Have you used the accusync flip up sights?

[Klem]

For HD if you think a 6" diameter target sounds about right then the Point Blank Range zero using a typical 2,450fps Grendel is 24M. Zero at 24M and when pointing at the centre of the target you will hit within the 6" circle from 0-300M. The second time the bullet crosses the sight axis is 255M. You can zero at 24M (26yds) or 255M (279yds).

[A5BLASTER]

For HD if you think a 6" diameter target sounds about right then the Point Blank Range zero using a typical 2,450fps Grendel is 24M. Zero at 24M and when pointing at the centre of the target you will hit within the 6" circle from 0-300M. The second time the bullet crosses the sight axis is 255M. You can zero at 24M (26yds) or 255M (279yds).

Thanks for the Intel Klem.

I already sighted in at 50 that should give me killzone hits on game or man from point blank to 150 yards.

That's the max I intend to use the irons, I have a red dot as primary and I will sight it in at 100 and that will cover me from point blank to 200.

200 being the max I intend for this rifle on game or man.

If I need more I will grab my scoped grendel.

[mdewitt71]

For HD if you think a 6" diameter target sounds about right then the Point Blank Range zero using a typical 2,450fps Grendel is 24M. Zero at 24M and when pointing at the centre of the target you will hit within the 6" circle from 0-300M. The second time the bullet crosses the sight axis is 255M. You can zero at 24M (26yds) or 255M (279yds).

Good info....
I need to get out and play with mine and watch what it does with different rounds.
I know my 90gr TNT handloads are over an 1" higher and right than Black and American Gunner 123s thru my 18" Grendel at 100 yards.

[LR1955]

Already got it sighted in did a 50 yard sight in.

Didn't have any trouble getting 5 shots at a inch with eld-m.

That should do fine for what I will be useing the iron sights for.

Rifle was sighted off bags and bench.

LR1955, Have you used the accusync flip up sights?

A5B:

I was just cutting up some. Should have used one of those smiley face things I guess.

I have not used those Leapers but some older Leapers BUIS. They were the M-16A2 type of rear and a front with a crude post that wasn't straight. The rear screw broke in short order and the front would fold back under recoil. They surely didn't cost much so no great loss. I replaced them with one of the first Magpul designs. They have their problems too but at least they can take some beating and not break. Front sight stays up under recoil, too.

The accusynch offset sight you mention looks a whole lot better in manufacture than the pot metal made in China Leapers stuff I bought so maybe they are doing a better job.

I gave the offset sight thing a try with some micro dot sights and kind of gave up on it. It is a bit easier to rotate a carbine around using a dot than a set of irons because all you have to do is rotate it so you can pick up one thing -- the dot. Will probably be a bit harder to get a fast sight alignment with offset irons. To function them, you will have to rotate the carbine and flip up the front and rear sight? Then get a position again. Probably not the best way to go but they don't need batteries so there you got it.

One other thing I learned the hard way with BUIS is that you got to get the right height of each or you won't be able to get a zero. Tried to measure but to no avail so I ended up having to return a front sight. No big deal but turn around took some time. Ugh.

I was also kind of upset because the front posts on these BUIS sights are stunningly wide so you sometimes lose the target, and forget about precision. If you can put bullets into a man size upper torso at 200 with yours, you should be super happy.

LR55

[A5BLASTER]

A5B:

I was just cutting up some. Should have used one of those smiley face things I guess.

I have not used those Leapers but some older Leapers BUIS. They were the M-16A2 type of rear and a front with a crude post that wasn't straight. The rear screw broke in short order and the front would fold back under recoil. They surely didn't cost much so no great loss. I replaced them with one of the first Magpul designs. They have their problems too but at least they can take some beating and not break. Front sight stays up under recoil, too.

The accusynch offset sight you mention looks a whole lot better in manufacture than the pot metal made in China Leapers stuff I bought so maybe they are doing a better job.

I gave the offset sight thing a try with some micro dot sights and kind of gave up on it. It is a bit easier to rotate a carbine around using a dot than a set of irons because all you have to do is rotate it so you can pick up one thing -- the dot. Will probably be a bit harder to get a fast sight alignment with offset irons. To function them, you will have to rotate the carbine and flip up the front and rear sight? Then get a position again. Probably not the best way to go but they don't need batteries so there you got it.

One other thing I learned the hard way with BUIS is that you got to get the right height of each or you won't be able to get a zero. Tried to measure but to no avail so I ended up having to return a front sight. No big deal but turn around took some time. Ugh.

I was also kind of upset because the front posts on these BUIS sights are stunningly wide so you sometimes lose the target, and forget about precision. If you can put bullets into a man size upper torso at 200 with yours, you should be super happy.

LR55

Oh no sir didn't take your post as a offense. Was wondering had you used them and could shed some light on the product I had bought.

I didn't get the 45% offset sights mine are typical top rail flip up style.

They are made for rail height.

Seem to be good material and design, made of aluminum and some nice features, good stiff lock down when fold up or down position and the adjustment knob for rear sight is nice a tight with got solid clicks when adjusted.

The front sight adjustment seems solid as well.

They take up less rail space then the magpuls I used before.

Time will tell but I would put them in the same class as the magpuls I have used so far.

I will try to get a few up close pics, they really are well designed and built, so I would think for my usage they will hold up just fine.

Sighting in with them went very smooth.

On a side note I am loving this AA light 16 inch barrel, if their 18 inch is of same quality I may sell off one of my jp barrels and replace it with anouther AA barrel.

[LR1955]

Oh no sir didn't take your post as a offense. Was wondering had you used them and could shed some light on the product I had bought.

I didn't get the 45% offset sights mine are typical top rail flip up style.

They are made for rail height.

Seem to be good material and design, made of aluminum and some nice features, good stiff lock down when fold up or down position and the adjustment knob for rear sight is nice a tight with got solid clicks when adjusted.

The front sight adjustment seems solid as well.

They take up less rail space then the magpuls I used before.

Time will tell but I would put them in the same class as the magpuls I have used so far.

I will try to get a few up close pics, they really are well designed and built, so I would think for my usage they will hold up just fine.

Sighting in with them went very smooth.

On a side note I am loving this AA light 16 inch barrel, if their 18 inch is of same quality I may sell off one of my jp barrels and replace it with anouther AA barrel.

A5B:

Roger -- did you think the front post was the right width?

LR55

[A5BLASTER]

A5B:

Roger -- did you think the front post was the right width?

LR55

Yea I like it a lil more then the front post on the magpuls I have used

[Klem]

Never used the AT3 red dot but there's quite a few mounts on Google Images that are semi-permanently fixed to the rail with a wrench. If your red dot mount is not quick detach then you will be looking through the (broken?) red dot when you deploy the BUIS. Hopefully that works. That said, if the red dot is at the same height above the rail as the BUIS then it makes for easy zeroing. You zero with the red dot and then flip up the BUIS and adjust until they co-witness with only the need to check zero with a couple of rounds.

To be honest I used to be a big fan of solid metal Troy flip-up BUIS but you can't use them with a normal scope attached and that requires taking it off, which means the scope has failed in some way. The likelihood of that ever happening is about zero. For close-in CQB with a scope (and you don't want to, or have time to take it off) on I have heard the offset fixed sights like Dueck Defense work. I haven't used them however so cannot comment.