6.5 Grendel versus 6mm ARC for whitetail

[LRRPF52]

There are SEALs in one of the DoD entities who likely put forth the solicitation, but not part of the SOCOM-side elements.

The other "DoD entities" are mostly from the Army, if my reading of the tea leaves is right. These elements were forced to cultivate a more cooperative relationship after a certain General took command of their parent organization, as there was a lot of competition and rivalry between them up until the 2000s.

[SDguy]

There are a couple of things to keep in mind when using the ARC for hunting:

When using classic cup and core hunting bullets, one should focus on deer weighing less than 130 - 150lb and use proper hunting bullets weigh at least 85 grains.

The advent of monometal lead-free bullets has changed things a bit. Monometal hunting bullets weighing as little as 50 grains should work reliable on these lighter deer. Much like with the 243 Win, monometal bullets in the 75-90 gr class will give reasonably reliable results on deer weighing as much as 300 lb.

The heavier bullet weights available for the Grendel will work well on game weighing twice as much.[/QUOTE]

Wow, good for a chuckle

Ill agree that Ill generally favor a heavier bullet offering for the 6mm ARC for hunting. Berger 108 grain Elite Hunter was very proficient at cleanly putting the buck below at a laser ranged 254 yards. Dropped stone dead at the crack of the shot with a brachial plexus hit. Large bodied 5ish year old near 300 lbs.

Bolt action 6mm ARC muzzle velocity of 2780 FPS. Impact velocity at 254 yards 1370 ft lbs available on impact. Not sure how much more I needed or what the Grendel may have had to offer over and above the 108grain Elite Hunter load in the 6mm ARC.


Call me crazy, though I never considered I may not have had enough gun when taking the shot on this guy.

[JASmith]

Regarding 6mm performance on deer, look over user comments on Midway and elsewhere.

You will see that 100gr-class bullets uniformly get excellent reviews in the southern tier of states, particularly in Florida, Texas and Arizona. These deer generally weigh less than 130 lb as adults.

Move to more northerly states where deer runn as much as 330 lb, and a few complaints of wounded and lost deer start to appear.

We see very few complaints of this nature with 125 grains and heavier cup and core bullets.

[Stinky Coyote]

Regarding 6mm performance on deer, look over user comments on Midway and elsewhere.

You will see that 100gr-class bullets uniformly get excellent reviews in the southern tier of states, particularly in Florida, Texas and Arizona. These deer generally weigh less than 130 lb as adults.

Move to more northerly states where deer runn as much as 330 lb, and a few complaints of wounded and lost deer start to appear.

We see very few complaints of this nature with 125 grains and heavier cup and core bullets.

Interesting viewpoint not discussed often enough. Even though my main criteria formula is sd/construction/impact velocity and will trust it implicitly even below 120 grain bullets and into the 6mm's but as noted and agreed by most...the 6mm's fall into the 'niche' end of spectrum for big game hunting, and naturally that means sub 120 gr bullets. The .25 cals have some bridge the gap bullet weights from there to the 6.5's but the 6.5's on up generally starts a 120 gr....excluding most copper stuff.

Having said all that, my 4th criteria in my selection was bullet weight 120 grains or higher to be a legitimate (not niche) bullet choice for big game hunting, granted at the lighter end...but still legit. For some reason outside the numbers I was simply wanting to throw at least that amount of lead down range at game.

And that's a dandy buck a couple posts up. Have a friend who's been smashing things with 6-dasher with 105's at 2900 fps for long time, good size Alberta mature buck at 500m instant dead no prob. Very precise shooter and deadly on game. Big game a snap for him and that combo as he's usually smashing coyotes with it, in hurry up situations, running, at distances etc. There really is nothing that will make big game a breeze better than coyote hunting imo.

[SDguy]

I have lived & hunted the northern states for in excess of 40 years now & cut my teeth hunting large South Dakota Whitetail deer with the 6mm Rem. My experience has been the 100 grain .243 hunting, class bullets leave little or nothing to be desired for deer hunting when put up against 270 win, 7mm-08, 308 win 7 30-06 for example.

I'v had a few seasons under my belt with bolt action 6.5mm Grendel & the 6mm ARC on a mini action rifle with 22" barrels. For my use inside of 300 yards, 6mm Arc leaves little or nothing to be desired. YMMV

I do subscribe to the notion that bullet choice & placement is key with any cartridge.

[JASmith]

even with well-placed shots

[SDguy]

Find this interesting that, as a seasoned Archery hunter that subscribes to a heavier total arrow weight than most archery hunters, I do not feel compromised with an 85 - 87 grain all copper bullet or the 108 Grain Elite hunter from the 6mm ARC bolt action rifle on large bodied deer. Of the three deer I have taken with the 6mm ARC, two were taken with CNS shots. Two years under my belt with the ARC & expect to choose the ARC next fall as well.

[JASmith]

Those 85-87 gr all copper bullets perform as well on game as 120-145 gr bullets like the Elite Hunter and other cup and core hunting bullets.

Remember, bullet placement is # 1. Bullet weight and construction remain important, however.

[Jake TN]

Just wanted to provide a little different perspective. I think 6mm or 6.5 is more than enough to get the job done. Adreniline can do crazy things in deer. I have personally seen a deer run a 100 yards with a blown out heart from a 30-06.

[SDguy]

The fella I purchased my first 6.5 6rendel barrel from, started to open my eyes to the high shoulder shot, for dropping a deer in its tracks. Well i was a slow learner, as it wasn't until I accidentally hit a deer with archery tackle & the deer collapsed at the impact of the arrow that I really started to look at the high shoulder shot with a vested interest.

Turns out there is a nerve bundle / Brachial plexus that when hit right does shut down the CNS like a switch. Rarly successful with a bow & arrow so I do not recommend this as an intentional shot placement bow & arrow ever. Though with rifle this CNS shot placement comes with high recommendations from many including myself.

As a guy that has usually butchered my own deer I have come to favor a high neck shot when I am steady enough for a surgical shot placement. Same DRT as high shoulder with no lost meat & so much nicer to butcher a clean blood free carcass.

[JASmith]

The high shoulder shot applies to a lot more calibers and cartridges than just the 6 vs 6.5 discussion. I will nonetheless respond because it is easy to find discussions revealing reasons why the high shoulder shot is less than ideal in spite of the dramatic results from a well-placed shot.

The main problem with the high shoulder shot is that a small miss forward, above, or above and behind will usually result in a wounded and lost deer.

Aiming for the upper part of the heart gives a lot more margin for error. The miss high and forward triggers the brachial nerve. Misses in other directions by the same amount for the most part result in rapid loss of consciousness and short runs. The bullet weight suggestions apply to this type of shot placement.

Returning to the first line of this post -- there are good arguments for finding or starting a thread dedicated to shot placement even though it comes up frequently in a lot of our threads. Further discussions of shot placement should be carried out there.

[stonehog]

Love that idea - shot placement from all angles with pics!

[Stinky Coyote]

I'm with aiming middle of kill zone also. It's hunting. Field accuracy is half as good as bench accuracy most of the time. Highest probability of success when going for middle of the good stuff.

[Remington Jim]

You get heavier bullets if you LIKE with a 6.5 ! And more Avail selection of factory ammo . Either will KILL DEER WELL .

[rickt300]

For my use as an AR hunting cartridge I give the Grendel an edge. I hunt with cup and core bullets and ranges are usually shorter than 150 yards. For my hunting I don't need the added wind bucking or flatter trajectory. This is not to say I am above shooting paper with the ARC or varmints.