Hornady CX 120 gr. on Hogs & a Coyote

[Harpoon1]

I like the way you think, but there is a slight flaw in your scheme. Lining up the hogs isn't so much of an issue as much as getting them to hold still while they are lined up is.

I found/read somewhere (random guy on a forum or YouTube) that 2000 fps was the opening threshold. It likely NOT an industry source, so I don't know. If you find correct info from a valid source, I would like to see what they say about lowest opening velocity. I haven't gotten around to sleuthing it, either.

On this podcast, they say 2000 FPS.

https://youtu.be/7DdNXtfWeWw

[Fess]

I asked about CX bullets with lower opening velocity or if they all required 2000fps Hornady responded:

"Hornady Manufacturing
4 weeks ago
Great question, and no that is not always the case. Some of the more specialized monolithics have different minimum expansion velocities. Give us a call at 800-338-3220 and press 3, or shoot us an email at tech@hornady.com for the specialized questions."

[Double Naught Spy]

Thanks, guys. 2000 fps is sounds about right, then. That is a bit of a shame given, that other brands are able to make copper bullets that expand at lower velocities.

Got another hog on Thursday. This was a weird hunt. I expected the hog to go down with the first shot because I expected it to be a solid CNS shot. Here's the thing, while folks speak of shot placement, it is only 1/3 of that ballistic equation. You much also have penetration and trajectory to consider. Well, the hog was on the move when I took my shot and the shot was a little off, but the point of impact still looked fine in the middle of the neck, if only the bullet failed to penetrate. This is weird. The shot was a grazing shot, twice! By that I mean it broke the skin, went into the subcutaneous muscle, and popped back out, traveled <2" and entered the skin again for a repeat, popping out again and lost to parts unknown, 1/2" total depth of penetration.

Shot #2 was a stop shot to try to bring the hog down. I hate having wounded hogs run off and the quicker the hog went down, the quicker I could get it finished off. I figured I had limited opportunities as the hog was in a holding area with cattle. Penetration was good, but as the hog was on the run, placement was too far back, but the trajectory, quartered through the lower body, promised to do a bunch of damage, and undoubtedly did, but definitely not immediately fatal or a stop shot as the hog continued. The bullet exited after 13".

Shot number #3 was well placed with the hog almost stationary, through the shoulders. Only, this bullet that had overpenetrated so well on the previous hunt, penetrated only 9" without hitting any heavy bone. The hog made it a few steps before collapsing.

However, I did recover bullet #3. The CX bullets are NOT expanding as much as the previous wound channel analysis might have indicated. Looking at Hornady's info, this isn't a surprise. Hornady says there should be 95% weight retention, but I got <90%, which isn't bad, but still double the loss Hornady was noting.

Examining the bullet revealed that it was NOT fully expanded. Based on this singular example, it would indicate that maybe Grendel velocity isn't getting the full potential from them. Hopefully, I can recover more bullets and see if this is a pattern or a fluke.

And the Carpe AnalySus video...

https://youtu.be/exsc-HMCVqw

[CJW]

Thanks DNS.

[sundowner]

Another great video Brian thanks for sharing .

[VASCAR2]

[Double Naught Spy]

Something went wrong. First video was supposed to have commentary. Here is the corrected video.

We had a great time, though we are both a little rusty. The manager for the property, who is also a hunter, contacted me yesterday after he collected up the hogs and put them in the property's bone yard. He said it was the largest feral hog he had ever seen. I felt sort of bad for him as I had spied hogs on the property a couple days prior and had let him know, as a courtesy. I thought he might like a crack at them as he lives just around the corner. Instead, he said I was welcome to go after them. I had no idea we would see anything bigger than 200 lbs. With our drought and such, the hogs seem to be smaller and smaller and the sows don't seem to be giving birth as much. What hogs we have been seeing, and not often, are generally sub 150 lbs. Then out of nowhere came this giant, LOL.

Here is the Carpe AnalySus version that discusses our shooting (hits/misses) and the one bullet recovered. There are some graphic pics, so it is Adult-Only.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spEZV7d1pjs&lc=UgySVoM3cgp22VIgwXd4AaABAg

[trubulator]

Just to bookend, I emailed Hornady and their response was an unequivocal 2000 FPS at impact to expand.

[Double Naught Spy]

Just to bookend, I emailed Hornady and their response was an unequivocal 2000 FPS at impact to expand.

Thanks, again!

That sort of is a real range limiter. Given the 2515 fps from my barrel, that would cap my shooting distance at 265 yards and really, probably at considerably less because close to the 2000 fps threshold, the bullet may start to expand, but not expand very much (based on my experience with other expanding bullets and thresholds). Maybe these are different, but I sort of doubt it.

[trubulator]

Thanks, again!

That sort of is a real range limiter. Given the 2515 fps from my barrel, that would cap my shooting distance at 265 yards and really, probably at considerably less because close to the 2000 fps threshold, the bullet may start to expand, but not expand very much (based on my experience with other expanding bullets and thresholds). Maybe these are different, but I sort of doubt it.

I am hunting at higher elevations. Assuming 2500 at the muzzle, I pencil out 300 yards at 4350' elevation, 325 at 6500', and 350 at 8500'. Bring it in 50 yards to ensure expansion and I have a usable load for my purposes. Shame they did not tune it to open up lower.

[Double Naught Spy]

50 yards to ensure expansion? Oof!

[trubulator]

50 yards to ensure expansion? Oof!

Nah, bring it in 50 yards to ensure expansion. So instead of 300 yards that gets me to 2000 FPS, I would limit shots to 250.

[EastTNHunter]

I saw your video of that strange wound channel. Any guesses on the cause, Brian?

[trubulator]

Thr frustrating thing about all of this is that it would not be that hard to make these bullets open up at lower velocities. Barnes came out with a TSX designed for 350 legend and when I asked them they said minimum impact velocity is 1200FPS.

[Double Naught Spy]

I saw your video of that strange wound channel. Any guesses on the cause, Brian?

Help me out. I am getting older, memory isn't what it used to be, and I have too many vids/hunts to recall exactly which one. Which video and/or which wound?

Thr frustrating thing about all of this is that it would not be that hard to make these bullets open up at lower velocities. Barnes came out with a TSX designed for 350 legend and when I asked them they said minimum impact velocity is 1200FPS.

For whatever reason(s), copper seems to be harder to work with than lead in terms of bullet expansion and such. The range of velocity between opening up and tearing off the petals is seemingly smaller than for lead. If a copper bullet opens at 1200 fps, would it also shed its petals going through the skin at 2400?

At 300 yards, the 120 gr CX still has over 1000 ft lbs of energy, but is below the 2000 fps threshold. 1000 ft lbs is the minimal velocity need for a bullet for deer/hog-sized game, according to many hunters and for many decades (whether this is right or wrong isn't relevant, just that it is a operational minimum that is commonly held valid.

Moreover, at the 2000 fps threshold, the CX isn't apt to expand very well and maybe not at all. It would be nice of the bullet didn't just start to expand, but expanded well all the way down down to 1000 ft lbs of energy. The bullets I have recovered are expanding okay, but certainly not fully and in the case of the first bullet, that was with impacting with over 1350 ft lbs and 2268 fps. I suspect I might need a contact shot to get actual full expansion and I don't know that would even be enough velocity.