To Be an American

[Klem]

The Icons are self-inflicted, Klem. Nothing automatic about them, as far as I know. Easily removed or modified, if you care to edit your post.

You are right, must have been in the frenzy of typing. My bad.

[NugginFutz]

You are right, must have been in the frenzy of typing. My bad.

No worries. Relax, breath. Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean that they aren't after you.

[montana]

The difference is the armed nudder on the street is far less dangerous than the power hungry nudder who dis arms his populace leaving them completely vulnerable to his will. As the NRA has stated the only thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. This is what division of power in the USA was intended to prevent. As one of our founding fathers Thomas Jefferson stated, when the government fears its citizens you have liberty, when the citizens fears its government you have tyranny. An estimated 262 million people were murdered by democide in the last century.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democide Our second amendment is not about fun, hunting or sport shooting but division of power. This is why we consider the second amendment our birthright and symbol of our freedom.

[Klem]

Ah yes, sound advice Nuggin'...I thought it was the Inquisition, come to torture me for being an Infidel (or is that a different mob?).

[Klem]

Montana,

Nice quote by Jefferson, and so true.

[Nukes]

So, it seems that the forum is now open for political and religious discussion... I'll keep this light.

We looked at running a food truck. To do so we needed 13, count 'em, 13 permissions for the "freedom" to work... and that is just the tip of the iceberg... but I promised to keep this post light.

[montana]

So, it seems that the forum is now open for political and religious discussion... I'll keep this light.

We looked at running a food truck. To do so we needed 13, count 'em, 13 permissions for the "freedom" to work... and that is just the tip of the iceberg... but I promised to keep this post light.

Yup, the slippery slide from citizen to subject at its worst. Then they wonder why we resist surrendering our gun rights to our fearless leaders!

[LRRPF52]

The whole point of posting the video in the OP was to bring awareness to veteran's issues, not open up some debate about politics or religion.

I posted it in the military section, which turned into something other than intended, so I moved it to 2A.

This is about veteran's perspectives on freedom, putting sacrifice into perspective. It was not meant to elicit a political or religious debate. Aside from politics, a lot of families have made huge sacrifices, and I thought it would be meaningful to bring attention to it.

[Nukes]

...This is about veteran's perspectives on freedom....

Some veterans' perspectives. There are other veterans' perspectives and there are other non-veterans' perspectives. To post one perspective is to invite those other perspectives on freedom—unless there is a double-standard here.

For decades I have given very good care of veterans. My heart goes out to them and, as our up-to-now private discussion mentioned, I have been working towards providing veterans the hyperbaric oxygen care that you recently recommended. I believe in it. My care for veterans is not just lip service. I understand your perspective, but there are other perspectives.

To promote one perspective while disallowing other perspectives strays too close to a not-at-all-free "Some animals are more equal than others."

I want to emphasize this—Veterans have been treated shamefully and I do my best to change that.

In view of the published rules, if they really are the rules, I would like all to stay away from politics. Shall we keep it light now?

[Michael]

I guess I took something different from the video...that those who serve in the military sacrifice/suspend a lot of the liberties that they defend . In this nation, especially those liberties guaranteed in the Bill of Rights. That those who serve sometimes don't know what the life of the private citizen is drastically different than their own until they leave the military. From spending a lot of time working with other nation's military, this view seems to cross international boundaries and is not necessarily a solely American phenomenon.

[Heywood]

Arguing about gun ownership on a gun forum is one thing. Tying it to religion is another. By all means believe in 'God' and your country, but don't get upset if I yawn loudly and glaze-over while you proselytise. And if you don't get too worked up with my disdain at your arrogance then I promise not to spout the belief systems in my country as if they are an exemplar of living. 'Founding Fathers' (did they all have kids?), Religious deities handing-out rights to humans...[Yawn]. The legislated freedom to carry (certain types of) gun because there is less communal trust in your own government after a civil war...In an individualistic society that celebrates the rights of individuals over the group.

While I own several I don't feel the need to carry a gun for protection where I live. Yet I am careful and respectful enough not to suggest my country is better than anyone else's. It's just a different way a society has chosen to live.

I hear what you are saying, as an agnostic I personally believe that all the English speeking countries of the world would be much better off if they did not believe their rights came from something bigger than their betters. The western world would be much better off without the Renaissance, the Magna Carta and the Constitution. I'm just glad they didn't try their hand at starting hospitals or universities with all those crazy beliefes in their head.

[Klem]

Starting a thread about veteran's rights in (North) America, punctuated by a video sponsored by commercial enterprise is a recipe for opinion. Related to veterans rights is government and to some on the forum government is linked to religion. A recipe for contentious opinion.

I'd prefer to talk about the 6.5mm Grendel on a site called '6.5 Grendel Forum'.

[JASmith]

...An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject.

Wow! That is the sound bite of sound bites supporting the 2A debate!

It captures both the essence and imples all the details underlying the second amendment!

Well said!!!!

[Drift]

Klem (with respect) what you are missing here is this is the "Room 2A" area of the Grendel forum. This area is a place where people can go to talk about the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States. Sure you you'd prefer talk about the 6.5 Grendel, thats why there are so many other threads on the site so that you can do just that. Besides, in past years with winter in full swing in North
America and little American shooting going on, little Grendel data is obtained/offered by non American Grendel shooters so the Grendel site kinda slows down around SHOT time, and stay slow till about April.

[cory]

I hear what you are saying, as an agnostic I personally believe that all the English speeking countries of the world would be much better off if they did not believe their rights came from something bigger than their betters. The western world would be much better off without the Renaissance, the Magna Carta and the Constitution. I'm just glad they didn't try their hand at starting hospitals or universities with all those crazy beliefes in their head.

I'm not sure if this should be taken in jest or not. :?